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artists_beware2016-04-20 09:53 pm
mwebwing.livejournal.com) wrote in artists_beware2016-04-20 09:53 pm
Entry tags:
Artist Beware: Biaknight
WHO: Biaknight, on FurAffinity http://www.furaffinity.net/user/biaknight/ (NOTE: Profile has NSFW material).
WHERE: FurAffinity
WHAT: They fell through on a YCH after giving me conflicting information about it being done, then jerked me around on the refund, then was caught getting commissions with the money they were supposed to pay me back with, and tried to drag the artist they had commissioned (LustBubbles) into it by lying about the nature of their relationship and the nature of the commission.
PROOF: Per community standards Biaknight's and LustBubbles' email addresses have been removed from the screenshots. They developed an annoying habit of responding to odd messages or sending new ones instead of just responding to the previous one, so some of the conversations had to be stitched back together or else have different titles on them. It does however represent the relevant information in order, all with the proper dates (the last three are not all dated, but it is one long conversation chopped up into pieces, and you can see the previous parts at the bottom on each).
All conversations should be read bottom to top. Some links contain NSFW discussion and languages.
Conversation #1 https://www.dropbox.com/s/k82m8s74iler9vv/biaconvo1.png?dl=0
Conversation #2 https://www.dropbox.com/s/utkgmxwlpd824me/biaconvo2.png?dl=0
Conversation #3 https://www.dropbox.com/s/xen2lln4wmehgb9/biaconvo3.png?dl=0
Conversation #4 https://www.dropbox.com/s/io1chfrbj7k347g/biaconvo4.png?dl=0
Conversation #5 https://www.dropbox.com/s/vhcauxh0ooefndf/biaconvo5.png?dl=0
Conversation #6 https://www.dropbox.com/s/7k1v817zsrhwyzv/biaconvo6.png?dl=0
Conversation #7 https://www.dropbox.com/s/b63imxzedpbmvs3/biaconvo7.png?dl=0
Conversation #8 https://www.dropbox.com/s/qa2c8x86246tb6f/biaconvo8.png?dl=0
Biaknight's Commission: https://www.dropbox.com/s/0vlxo13dygj9xma/biacommish.png?dl=0
Final attempt to not pay: https://www.dropbox.com/s/0cxfhsfup2kg96f/nomoney.png?dl=0
LustBubble's reaction w/permission to use conversation in this Artist Beware: https://www.dropbox.com/s/cfgxh23sw90fu3y/lustbubblespermission.png?dl=0
EXPLAIN: On February the 22nd I had commented on a YCH by Biaknight and ended up claiming it (the YCH post has since been removed, but we discuss it in the conversations linked above). I made the payment of $15 dollars (she tried to get me to send it as Friends and Family, but I refused), and was told they would start on it ASAP. March 3rd I was told that they had the sketch completed, and would send me a WIP. When it never came I messaged again on the 15th of the same month to be told they had done it, but somehow lost it. Rather than completing it "again" themselves, they were going to pay another person to do it and implied this process had already started without my consent and I should expect a WIP in about a week. I was not ok with this, expressed such, and requested a refund. They said they did not have the money to give me, but would go ahead and do the art themselves and have it to me in three days.
On the 19th of March they said that they had been too busy, but were going to go ahead and give me the refund along with doing the art anyways, and that they would pay me just as soon as they had money which would be a couple days to a week, but they could not do so now because all money had to go to food.
On March 31st, they commissioned LustBubbles as part of a sale, purchasing a piece of art for $12, three dollars short of what they owed me (http://www.furaffinity.net/view/19543925/). On April 5th I checked in again, only to be told they were still waiting on money. I told them I wasn't comfortable waiting longer and would likely file a charge back in no more than a week to get my money back. They told me a big story about literally just finding out they owe their school hundreds of dollars due to a misunderstanding, and that all of their money has been going to food, and they have bigger things to worry about than paying me back. I told them I would be moving ahead with the charge back at my earliest convenience as a result of that, they said it was a dickish move not giving them a full week, and that they would pay me a in a couple of days.
On April 11th they posted a new piece of art from LustBubbles, and made a point of saying for those who are going to ask about money, she purchased it before she was short on money. I checked through LustBubbles' gallery for sales and YCHs, and found where she had spent money on a commission when she had told me she was broke and all her money was going to food. I confronted her about this, she told me that LustBubbles had asked her to do it like that when in reality she had purchased the slots months ago, and she said she was going to block me once she had paid me back. I didn't believe it, and she said that what I couldn't see was the conversation she had with LustBubbles where she was asked to comment on the YCH as though just buying it, and said I wasn't going to get the money within the hour, and she even went as far as to tell me she physically did not have the money, only having $11 dollars in her account. However, after I threatened to start messaging people on her watchers list about it, she immediately sent me the money in full.
She asked that I not post any journals or make any submissions discussing what happened, and I declined, saying I was absolutely filling out an Artist Beware if nothing else. She insisted she was not trying to cheat me, and had only gotten commissions from LustBubbles before I had commissioned her, and at no other time. I asked for proof in the form of screenshots of LustBubbles asking her to comment as she did, and she refused to do so, even with personal parts blacked out. She said she talked with LustBubbles about things she couldn't talk to about with anyone else, and it was simply too personal to share even with personal bits covered. I pointed out I didn't believe her, she continued insisting that it is true, and she didn't know why LustBubbles asked for payment when she commented since she had already paid.
I messaged LustBubbles about it and relayed the story and Biaknight's claims. LustBubbles said she had no clue what Biaknight was talking about, she had never asked Biaknight to act like she was just then getting the commission, and said none of the commissions she had from Biaknight were as old as she claimed. She was also confused about the claims that they had strongly personal conversations, saying that they were not close friends and she could think of nothing of that nature that would have prevented Biaknight from showing me proof of her claims.
And so here we are, I thought I would submit an Artist Beware so that others can make an informed decision before commissioning this person as the whole thing reeked of a scamming attempt.
EDIT: Since more people have turned out to criticize me for being too harsh with the artist than they have to actually comment on what the artist did, I feel like I should add a little on here.
Here is the thing. I was more than patient with this person. I was more than civil with this person. I gave this person the benefit of the doubt. I treated them pleasantly and with respect right up until the point when I found out they had been lying to me, had cheated me, and was just blatantly avoiding paying me back. I was perfectly civil right up until the point they continued to lie to my face even when caught and threatened to block me when I called them out on it. And at that point I was under no obligation to continue being respectful, continue being civil, continue being nice. Yes, I could have filed a charge back and was content to do so before I found she was lying to me and had the money the whole time. And yes, I could have simply filed a charge back there. But I had a great deal going on and it would have been inconvenient for me to wait on a charge back, and after they had lied to my face and cheated me I am under no obligation to inconvenience myself for them or to uphold some standards of respectfulness or politeness that quite frankly they don't deserve. I needed it wrapped up and done with promptly, and so I did just that. If you have a problem with that, you are free to handle YOUR business however YOU like.
If you feel the need to signal how moral you are because you would never be so harsh as to threaten someone who had just spent weeks lying to your face and was spending your money while telling you they could barely afford food, by all means be my guest. If you want to say beware on me because you dislike that I'm not going to tiptoe through the tulips and play nice with someone who stole from me and lied to me when they were caught, knock yourself out. But I'm done responding to such comments. To be completely honest, your opinions on how I handled my business are completely and totally irrelevant to me. I could not care less.
You are welcome that I took the time and effort to let you know this person will scam you and lie to your face about it. Have a nice day.
WHERE: FurAffinity
WHAT: They fell through on a YCH after giving me conflicting information about it being done, then jerked me around on the refund, then was caught getting commissions with the money they were supposed to pay me back with, and tried to drag the artist they had commissioned (LustBubbles) into it by lying about the nature of their relationship and the nature of the commission.
PROOF: Per community standards Biaknight's and LustBubbles' email addresses have been removed from the screenshots. They developed an annoying habit of responding to odd messages or sending new ones instead of just responding to the previous one, so some of the conversations had to be stitched back together or else have different titles on them. It does however represent the relevant information in order, all with the proper dates (the last three are not all dated, but it is one long conversation chopped up into pieces, and you can see the previous parts at the bottom on each).
All conversations should be read bottom to top. Some links contain NSFW discussion and languages.
Conversation #1 https://www.dropbox.com/s/k82m8s74iler9vv/biaconvo1.png?dl=0
Conversation #2 https://www.dropbox.com/s/utkgmxwlpd824me/biaconvo2.png?dl=0
Conversation #3 https://www.dropbox.com/s/xen2lln4wmehgb9/biaconvo3.png?dl=0
Conversation #4 https://www.dropbox.com/s/io1chfrbj7k347g/biaconvo4.png?dl=0
Conversation #5 https://www.dropbox.com/s/vhcauxh0ooefndf/biaconvo5.png?dl=0
Conversation #6 https://www.dropbox.com/s/7k1v817zsrhwyzv/biaconvo6.png?dl=0
Conversation #7 https://www.dropbox.com/s/b63imxzedpbmvs3/biaconvo7.png?dl=0
Conversation #8 https://www.dropbox.com/s/qa2c8x86246tb6f/biaconvo8.png?dl=0
Biaknight's Commission: https://www.dropbox.com/s/0vlxo13dygj9xma/biacommish.png?dl=0
Final attempt to not pay: https://www.dropbox.com/s/0cxfhsfup2kg96f/nomoney.png?dl=0
LustBubble's reaction w/permission to use conversation in this Artist Beware: https://www.dropbox.com/s/cfgxh23sw90fu3y/lustbubblespermission.png?dl=0
EXPLAIN: On February the 22nd I had commented on a YCH by Biaknight and ended up claiming it (the YCH post has since been removed, but we discuss it in the conversations linked above). I made the payment of $15 dollars (she tried to get me to send it as Friends and Family, but I refused), and was told they would start on it ASAP. March 3rd I was told that they had the sketch completed, and would send me a WIP. When it never came I messaged again on the 15th of the same month to be told they had done it, but somehow lost it. Rather than completing it "again" themselves, they were going to pay another person to do it and implied this process had already started without my consent and I should expect a WIP in about a week. I was not ok with this, expressed such, and requested a refund. They said they did not have the money to give me, but would go ahead and do the art themselves and have it to me in three days.
On the 19th of March they said that they had been too busy, but were going to go ahead and give me the refund along with doing the art anyways, and that they would pay me just as soon as they had money which would be a couple days to a week, but they could not do so now because all money had to go to food.
On March 31st, they commissioned LustBubbles as part of a sale, purchasing a piece of art for $12, three dollars short of what they owed me (http://www.furaffinity.net/view/19543925/). On April 5th I checked in again, only to be told they were still waiting on money. I told them I wasn't comfortable waiting longer and would likely file a charge back in no more than a week to get my money back. They told me a big story about literally just finding out they owe their school hundreds of dollars due to a misunderstanding, and that all of their money has been going to food, and they have bigger things to worry about than paying me back. I told them I would be moving ahead with the charge back at my earliest convenience as a result of that, they said it was a dickish move not giving them a full week, and that they would pay me a in a couple of days.
On April 11th they posted a new piece of art from LustBubbles, and made a point of saying for those who are going to ask about money, she purchased it before she was short on money. I checked through LustBubbles' gallery for sales and YCHs, and found where she had spent money on a commission when she had told me she was broke and all her money was going to food. I confronted her about this, she told me that LustBubbles had asked her to do it like that when in reality she had purchased the slots months ago, and she said she was going to block me once she had paid me back. I didn't believe it, and she said that what I couldn't see was the conversation she had with LustBubbles where she was asked to comment on the YCH as though just buying it, and said I wasn't going to get the money within the hour, and she even went as far as to tell me she physically did not have the money, only having $11 dollars in her account. However, after I threatened to start messaging people on her watchers list about it, she immediately sent me the money in full.
She asked that I not post any journals or make any submissions discussing what happened, and I declined, saying I was absolutely filling out an Artist Beware if nothing else. She insisted she was not trying to cheat me, and had only gotten commissions from LustBubbles before I had commissioned her, and at no other time. I asked for proof in the form of screenshots of LustBubbles asking her to comment as she did, and she refused to do so, even with personal parts blacked out. She said she talked with LustBubbles about things she couldn't talk to about with anyone else, and it was simply too personal to share even with personal bits covered. I pointed out I didn't believe her, she continued insisting that it is true, and she didn't know why LustBubbles asked for payment when she commented since she had already paid.
I messaged LustBubbles about it and relayed the story and Biaknight's claims. LustBubbles said she had no clue what Biaknight was talking about, she had never asked Biaknight to act like she was just then getting the commission, and said none of the commissions she had from Biaknight were as old as she claimed. She was also confused about the claims that they had strongly personal conversations, saying that they were not close friends and she could think of nothing of that nature that would have prevented Biaknight from showing me proof of her claims.
And so here we are, I thought I would submit an Artist Beware so that others can make an informed decision before commissioning this person as the whole thing reeked of a scamming attempt.
EDIT: Since more people have turned out to criticize me for being too harsh with the artist than they have to actually comment on what the artist did, I feel like I should add a little on here.
Here is the thing. I was more than patient with this person. I was more than civil with this person. I gave this person the benefit of the doubt. I treated them pleasantly and with respect right up until the point when I found out they had been lying to me, had cheated me, and was just blatantly avoiding paying me back. I was perfectly civil right up until the point they continued to lie to my face even when caught and threatened to block me when I called them out on it. And at that point I was under no obligation to continue being respectful, continue being civil, continue being nice. Yes, I could have filed a charge back and was content to do so before I found she was lying to me and had the money the whole time. And yes, I could have simply filed a charge back there. But I had a great deal going on and it would have been inconvenient for me to wait on a charge back, and after they had lied to my face and cheated me I am under no obligation to inconvenience myself for them or to uphold some standards of respectfulness or politeness that quite frankly they don't deserve. I needed it wrapped up and done with promptly, and so I did just that. If you have a problem with that, you are free to handle YOUR business however YOU like.
If you feel the need to signal how moral you are because you would never be so harsh as to threaten someone who had just spent weeks lying to your face and was spending your money while telling you they could barely afford food, by all means be my guest. If you want to say beware on me because you dislike that I'm not going to tiptoe through the tulips and play nice with someone who stole from me and lied to me when they were caught, knock yourself out. But I'm done responding to such comments. To be completely honest, your opinions on how I handled my business are completely and totally irrelevant to me. I could not care less.
You are welcome that I took the time and effort to let you know this person will scam you and lie to your face about it. Have a nice day.
(frozen comment) no subject
Normal rules of etiquette don't always go out the window. When an artist is dealing with a bad customer we're always expected to be nice and diplomatic and take any abuse or nonsense with grace thrown at us to remain professional and maintain a good image. The same should go for a client. If an artist treats you unprofessionally during a transaction, you should strive to be the better person and handle it with maturity, not threatening to go around messaging people that follow them or do something petty to further drive their reputation into the ground.
You're making excuse after excuse on why you think it was okay to threaten harassment on them. I don't care if you think they're a "liar and a cheat," harassment is wrong, and you using that as a form of intimidation (I'm not sure if the word "blackmail" is correct here, English isn't my first language) to get your money back when you had a peaceful and legal alternative is a horrible move and reflects on you. And multiple people are calling you out on that.
"There are plenty of artists who have worked with me who can attest to that I am not a difficult customer, and I am very patient with those who remain professional and respectful." Just like you demanded hard evidence from the artist you dealt with, I'd have to see hard evidence of this to believe it based on your behavior in this situation alone.
The difference between posting here and messaging people individually is that Artists Beware is like posting a review of an artist (or client) like you'd post a review about a restaurant on Yelp or somewhere else on, say, TripAdvisor. Same concept, different field- and people will see this article and go "Welp, don't wanna work with that person!" Messaging people individually is like walking up to someone eating McDonald's food and interrupting their time to tell them about how personally offended you were when they forgot to put pickles on your burger and didn't fix it for you and you had to demand a refund. It's a bad experience but going up to individuals and telling them about it isn't necessary in the slightest, and you're going to look silly doing it.
"Is what I did distasteful? Absolutely. But I'm not going to lose sleep over it considering what I was faced with that led to me resorting to such tactics."
WOW. YIKES! Beware on you. At least you're honest with yourself about it! You're not looking to justify yourself to anyone, but you're defending why you did something extremely uncalled for that makes people want to avoid you? Sounds like looking to justify yourself to me.
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I wouldn't work with the artist, or OP, frankly :/
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You can pretend I have a holier-than-thou-attitude, but I'm not the one sitting here lecturing people on moral behavior and how to handle their personal business.
(frozen comment) no subject
Nobody said the artist was ever right for lying to you or doing what they did, but at the same time? Your frustration is no reason to ever bully and harass someone by dragging other people into it. Period. You can be harsh all you want, I know I would be, but I definitely wouldn't cross the line of being invasive and being an outright instigator and a bully.
But yeah, okay, calling out potential bullying and harassment and dragging other people into business on top of hypocrisy on your part is "telling you how to handle your personal business." And on the topic of your other comment, maybe you shouldn't buy art when you know you owe bills. Just a suggestion.
I don't know where you get the idea that you're immune to being called out on something you did wrong when you post to a public forum. You set yourself up for that.
(frozen comment) mod comment
For the OP and others, please do not attempt to continue. It will be frozen.