Beware: Starfinder/Kannos

[utunu.livejournal.com]

WHO: Kannos, Starfinder, Astray, etc.

WHERE: https://www.weasyl.com/~kannos, https://inkbunny.net/Kannos, although this commission was not initiated in either of those places.

WHAT: An extensive traditional painting with full background of a tribal wolf character in a forest/jungle by a waterfall.

WHEN: July of 2005.  That is not a typo.  2005.  A brief timeline follows.

• Commission initiated in 2005.  Had found Starfinder's work online, really liked it, decided I'd commission her.  This was my first real commission attempt in the fandom, back when I was apparently a bit too trusting.  Agreed on large traditional piece, full background, agreed upon price of $900.


• Initial payment of $450 paid on July 15, 2005.


• Soon thereafter, Starfinder expressed concern that she had a car insurance expense.  Since, at that point, the commission had been going well, along with her stating that it would be done very soon (in a matter of a week or two), I decided to be kind and help out, giving her the remaining amount due of $450 in the assumption I would not have long to wait.  And I guess that was my mistake; now that she had her money, she had no reason to ever finish the piece.


• Image of the paypal (thanks to Starfinder, actually - she sent this to me because, in the AB post from May regarding the petition to get her back on FA I had finally come out and mentioned my commission experience with her, and she didn't care for me saying 'almost $1000' therein).  http://imgur.com/IuxYuPN


• Communication continued, for a while... I would ping her regularly on IM and email, she would respond with the 'really soon', or comment about the reasons she hadn't had chance yet.  It became harder and harder to get in touch with her over time, and eventually she stopped responding altogether.  I continued to ping, as the years went by, every 6 months or so.


• Now the AB post in May of 2013 came about (http://artists-beware.livejournal.com/679851.html).  Finally I decided to say something.  I hadn't posted before, because of the (foolish) hope that maybe she'd come round and my associated fear that if I posted something she'd take offense and I'd lose that 1% chance of ever getting my piece.  Please feel free to read that AB post and see my (much abridged) story there.  Any proof required of the existence and acknowledgement of this particular commission is contained within Starfinder's own responses there.


• Starfinder says she will make good on it.  Of course, it's not going to be what I originally wanted - she doesn't want to do traditional any more.  But at this point, I figured anything would be better than nothing.


• And then the Starfinder Past-Due Shout-Out (http://artists-beware.livejournal.com/679971.html).  Further acknowledgement, and she actually started doing preliminary sketches.  Perhaps something would finally come of this!


• And.... no.  I immediately offered feedback on said sketches, was communicating via email with her, and then... silence.  It seems to coincide with the failure of the petition to get her back on FA.  I have sent emails asking for just a response, but have gotten nothing.  The last email I received from her was Oct 5, 2013.  I have sent successive ones since, but nothing.

EXPLAIN: Most of it's up there in 'WHEN'.  All I can say is, this has caused me a LOT of grief and heartache over the years.  I would have been happier throwing that money in a fire, because then at least it was over and done with, rather than being strung along for so many years, coupled with the feeling of being scammed.  I have been completely polite and courteous throughout the ENTIRE situation, and bent over backwards to accommodate all her crises and excuses.  I'm thoroughly fed up.  This was my first commission attempt, and soured me on the whole thing for several years afterwards.  For those who know me and my character, I get a lot of art done these days, and usually from really awesome artists.  And I'm happy that I finally was able to make the attempt at commissioning again.  Thank you to ALL those other artists who made the commissioning process a wonderful one; you've made me a happier Utunu, and I made it so I did not completely lose my faith in the process. :)
Please feel free, in the comments, if any of you would like me to speak further on any aspects of this rather sordid tale. :) I'd be happy to answer.  Right now, what I really want?  I want a refund.  I wanted traditional, she doesn't want to do that.  And you know what?  Anything I did get, after almost 9 years, would feel tainted anyhow.  I had better sign off here, before I start ranting too much. :)
And mods, please let me know if you need anything further for this AB post.  I haven't done this before, so hopefully this is sufficient.

Comments

[missy-da-dane.livejournal.com]

I have given up on her as well. Although I only spent 70$ I still feel cheated. After 3 or 4 times of her saying I will get my art I have given up. My only wish is that nobody will ever commission her again. But they do

[silverwolf877.livejournal.com]

I would still suggest posting an a_b about her, a lot of people just let it go and lose out on a refund or art, but I'm sure if enough people keep on her case about completing her backlog, she will eventually get it done. $70 is a lot of money - a week's worth of groceries for some people.

Im not trying to push you or anything, if you want to drop it because you're sick of waiting around, I understand that too. I wonder how many people she actually still owes? I'm sure a lot have dropped off the radar and forgotten about it.

[val !! (from livejournal.com)]

how disappointing! i was considering getting art from her in the future... but, seeing as your issue is STILL unresolved after all this time i'm not going to bother giving her any money. there isn't anything she can say to excuse taking $900 from you.

[silverwolf877.livejournal.com]

Is there any possible way she could be banned from Inkbunny? I think the only way this is going to get solved is if she is banned from the sites she is making money off, *at least* until her backlog is complete.

[sapphistscot.livejournal.com]

It won't happen. Since it happened before she went to Inkbunny, the staff won't do anything, Greenreaper confirmed this in previous posts about her. She'd have to start scamming Inkbunny members before they'd do anything.

[bio-pelt.livejournal.com]

It's very surprising to see that she still has active accounts on other popular art websites. There's no doubt in my mind that these same situations are happened there too, which is really just a shame because it seemed like she wanted to get everything on track.

But actions speak louder than words.

Hopefully you guys can really take her to court over this. It's not a game.

[rabbitswift.livejournal.com]

I mostly just lurk in this community, but I wanted to say I'm sorry this person has strung you along for so many years. You've had the patience of Job with them, and it's a shame they can't just come through with their obligation. If there's any chance of you getting a refund from them, I sincerely hope you do.

[magicporpoise.livejournal.com]

Please, dont let her get away with something like this, fight for it.

[sekhmet.livejournal.com]

Aaaand she has set up a patreon site :S

https://www.weasyl.com/journal/42812/supporting-art

[jesidres.livejournal.com]

Now THAT seriously worries me. With so many legitimate artists relying on Patreon to keep up their artwork, once she starts scamming over there... ugh.

I hope someone brings her long track record of scamming up to them... I'd hope they'd have little interest to be associated with such a problematic history.

[metallik-hasse.livejournal.com]

I've had to look into small claims court previously, and less money involved in my situation. I would seriously consider pressing charges. With the sheer amount of proof, and the amount of clients she's scammed, I should think the case is pretty cut and dry. She really has no reasonable excuse to keep your money.
Many lawyers even offer free consultations, and I really think it would be worth looking into.
Sorry you had the misfortune of having done business with this person, and I hope things work out for you. :C

[ljmydayaway.livejournal.com]

It's been nearly 10 years, it's very likely that they've waited too long to be able to file charges against her.

[tock-fast.livejournal.com]

Wow... that is horrible. I feel guilty if I leave a commission for more than a week without an update, no matter the queue size, or the size of the piece. How she can leave something for almost ten years, and run off with the money... yikes; her moral compass seems a bit broken.

She seems to be keeping busy on other sites, so hopefully she'll use some of that energy, and return it to things more pressing, like refunding what she owes to you.

So sorry to hear something like this happened to you. I've seen your character around, and the artists who work on your pieces always seem to be in good spirits.

Best of luck!

[ctk-hullo.livejournal.com]

If she's doing good with the pay-on-completion model, I'd like to see someone commission her, get their image, and tell her, "Since I know you have outstanding debts I've taken the liberty of sending payment directly to those you owe." Which would be it's own kind of shady, but, damn, this artist is unbelievable.

[zackfig.livejournal.com]

that sounds a lot like John Campbell's rant o_O???

[utunu.livejournal.com]

To all of you who have expressed sympathies and condolences over the ridiculousness of this whole scenario, thanks very much. :) I do appreciate the support! I'm still waiting to hear back from her on email - after she emailed Friday night because of the post I made on her Past Due thread, I emailed back Saturday morning, but no response yet. Will keep things updated. I do hope she actually comes on here and says what she plans on doing reparation-wise, but it's unlikely.

[hidden-kyuubi.livejournal.com]

I say if you want to get her off er butt about it, let her know you'll be consulting a lawyer soon to see what can be done about itif it doesn't get resolved, or see if the lawyer can set up a new contract between you two that she has to have it done by X date. I bet it'd be done pretty quickly after.

[selunca.livejournal.com]

Jesus Christ.. Way to go Star.. :\

[corvus-animus.livejournal.com]

I don't normally post here, but today I learned Starfinder is still a thing. Huh.

I'm very sorry about this, but I have to add to the chorus of "not surprised" :/

I really hope this gets resolved! You seem way too awesome to have to go through this!

[ithinkdirt.livejournal.com]

yuck, and yet, somehow unsurprising. I'd say I'd want my money back at this point, but I think we all know how likely that is (are we going to get a sob story again?) If she'd just been paying you back $10 a month since the whole thing went pear shaped she'd have you paid off by now, but I guess that isn't worth doing.

also I am amused and vaguely grossed out that she'd get so uppity at you stating "nearly $1000" because honestly it seems like splitting hairs - I mean, really, does it make her look THAT much better? Not to mention I'd be willing to bet that most people would find the statement "nearly $1000" to be acceptably true/accurate since $900 IS nearly a thousand? and also a heck of a lot of people would say the difference is negligible in terms of getting defensive about such a statement.

[tealmoonxiv.livejournal.com]

The more I read the worse it gets. -_-

[val !! (from livejournal.com)]

someone posted a comment about this issue on her weasyl journal and her response (dated the 16th) was:

"I'm in touch with him via e-mail. I don't care for the mob mentality, so I'll deal with the person who I actually need to correspond with, not the general public. It's between me and this individual, not me and the public."

editted for correct pronouns. sorry!

[silverwolf877.livejournal.com]

I noticed this as well. I took a screencap of it too as proof in case it's deleted. Utunu still hasn't come on to say if it's true or not (hence why I took the screencap).

[warally.livejournal.com]

I know of two people she possibly owes art to from Inkbunny (ie. they paid upfront recently). One is a definite, the other is just from a comment I read on one of her journals.

Unfortunately I can't provide proof unless those people want to give it to me. But yes, from the sounds of it she still does on occasion take money upfront and not return the goods.

[warally.livejournal.com]

Sorry for another post but I just went through all her journals and she has deleted the comment where the person was implying they hadn't received their art yet but it had been paid for. Unless it was in a submission somewhere. Anyway, at the moment I have no proof of that. Sorry guys.

Here's another one I forgot about: she actually tried to scam somebody with her fine art business too: http://kezhound.tumblr.com/post/22130396311/your-assistance-is-requested-to-stop-a-thief

[silverwolf877.livejournal.com]

Wow she's really set herself up to fail in the art world. In a perfect world she'd have a criminal record by now.

[fangwoof.livejournal.com]

This is just horrible that this has been going on for so many years and so many people were scammed. I hope she gets stopped but unfortunately, she'll probably continue to do this until drastic action is taken.

(frozen comment)

[subrik92.livejournal.com]

OH POOR THING JUST GOT A NEW CAR GIVEN TO HER

http://tinypic.com/r/2mmslf7/8

(frozen comment)

[thaily.livejournal.com]

Great! Maybe her aunt&uncle can also give her some oil painting materials so she can do the OP's commission.

[bateleureagle.livejournal.com]

Utunu, she actually said she won't refund you?
I think she'll find that if she is unable to deliver her end of the contract, she is legally obliged to refund, whether or not she wants to. Wanting isn't part of the equation.

Hey Starfinder: Grow up, please. Do your art you owe in the medium agreed upon, or refund the guy. It's not hard.

[hidden-kyuubi.livejournal.com]

She claims she doesn't have the stuff to draw in traditional/do traditional paintings anymore... but you think that'd be cheaper than a refund and after all this time she really SHOULD be trying to make her client happy.

[utunu.livejournal.com]

I will give occasional updates on how all this is going, for those interested.

She has been in email contact with me, somewhat regularly. I have suggested two possible poses/scenarios, and she had stated she would sketch them out. I had suggested thumbnails, so that we can narrow down a pose that works, but Starfinder says she doesn't do the thumbnail method, so am waiting to see what she comes up with for the two poses. She has not yet gotten to me with initial sketches; I will post when she has done so.

[hidden-kyuubi.livejournal.com]

Good luck with it all. I hope it works out. Just don't let her take advantage of your kindness again, and I hope this gets resolved for you in a way that gives you as little stress, and the best outcome possible for you.

[utunu.livejournal.com]

Update #2

Have not heard from Starfinder since March 23rd. Have email-pinged three times, no responses. Getting frustrated again!

[norsepaw.livejournal.com]

Can understand you are frustrated.
she clearly is better writing "I am going to change for the better" then to finish what she owes.

[utunu.livejournal.com]

Update #3

Last heard April 10. Waited until May, because of her recent personal stuff she went through, and wanted to refrain from pestering until I saw she was doing art again. Pinged a couple times in May, but have heard nothing.

[silverwolf877.livejournal.com]

Heard anything new?

[artificefox.livejournal.com]

She owes me art as well that I paid for years ago. I've put up an a_b about it just waiting for mods to get it. Reading these makes me wonder indeed just how many people have lost money commissioning her.

[kayla-la.livejournal.com]

There isn't a post in the queue by you, currently, which means it was rejected for fixes. You should have a rejection notice in the email attached to your Livejournal account, as they get automatically sent there.