Beware: Khanken

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

WHO: Khanken@FA http://www.furaffinity.net/user/khanken/
WHERE: FurAffinity
WHAT: 3 head to hip painted commissions, for a grand total of 120$
WHEN: Was commissioned February 27th, 2013 11:10 AM for the first commission, then on February 27th, 2013 01:24 PM I was commissioned for 2 more piece
PROOF: journal caps/links of the transaction. http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/4384187/
cap view- http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/1052/journalfuraffinitydotne.png

EXPLAIN:
After the first commission was completed, he asked for a refund. I could not refund anything since the last 2 were already in the color stage, which is outlined in my Terms of Service. He said it was fine and would make the most of the last 2. (as seen here: http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/4384187/#cid:32180043 )

After 4 days, I woke up today to find a claim dispute was put on my paypal and his comment on my commission journal. I called Paypal and explained the situation to them. The chargebacks for all art were erased and the claim was settled. The user has been blocked until his 2 other pieces are fully rendered due to his behavior.

Journal caps of the original transactions and following inappropriate behavior. http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/4384187/, cap of the journal http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/1052/journalfuraffinitydotne.png

After blocking him, I found this journal, and received the following email, stating a Cease and Desist, though he holds no rights or trademark. FA administration took care of the journal, so I can't provide a link, but here is a cap.




He also tried to say he needed the money due to his dog dying, and needing to purchase another one


Here is the work as it stands: The 2 busts in the color stages (NSFW) 1, 2, the rendered image

I will not be working with this customer again, and caution other artists to stick to their Terms of Service when dealing with him.

EDIT(March 11 2013 9:48pm):
 Khanken@FA telling another artist why they can not buy more art  after paypal resolved the issue, despite originally telling me it was for a dog.
http://imageshack.us/f/341/userpageoflittlekittyra.png/

 Khanken@FA asking another artist for funds.
http://imageshack.us/f/18/userpageofinsomniacovrl.png/
http://imageshack.us/f/515/userpageofkhankenfuraff.png/

Claim, dispute, and resolution from paypal.
http://imageshack.us/f/526/newsignificantlynotasde.png/
http://imageshack.us/f/14/newmessagepostedcasepp0.png/
http://imageshack.us/f/854/yourdisputehasbeenescal.png/
http://imageshack.us/f/202/notificationofcaseresol.png/

EDIT(March 14 2013 12:58pm):

Tried to give the commissioner a resolution by offering to completely redo the last commission as long as he gave exact details and examples of what he was expecting from my gallery.
http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/2207/stillofferingaresolutio.png

Comments

[neolucky.livejournal.com]

Hey there, I'm letting this post though - however one small thing! Could you please put this post behind an LJ-cut? That'd be really great, thanks a bunch.

Also YIPES, that behavior from the customer...I'll be avoiding them for any future work, seeing as they are around a lot and to purchase a lot.

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

of course not a problem. I'll put behind a cut.

[ducttapeninja.livejournal.com]

I've heard nothing but bad things about this guy; from what I've heard people, and what I've seen of his attitude in various places around FA, he just seems like a horrible person to have to work with.

Beware very, VERY well warranted.

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

Yes, I've noticed this as well now that I see him pop up a lot.I really wish I had did my research. I normally don't since I've never had a customer act this way ever. But this is a lesson I've learned from.

[taasla.livejournal.com]

I just can't believe he tried to order a C&D on you when an artist retains copyright to their work. Wow, beware very well deserved thank you for coming out with this!

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

It was another read flag he did not read my tos at all. I'm very happy so many people pushed me to make an ab.

[lackoflollies.livejournal.com]

Oh goodness, yea commissioner beware. Thank you for your post!

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

Not a problem, glad people seriously pushed me to write this.

[teekchan.livejournal.com]

Wow. He just watched me. I am quite wary now.

I also agree that the dog thing was most likely a guilt trip.

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

I also assumed that it was a guilt trip after how he acted and rereading his emails.

[totschrei.livejournal.com]

Yikes!
I just have to say you handled yourself very professionally.
As for the customer.... I cannot believe the attitude.
Beware very much appreciated.

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

Thank you.

[timelapsedecay.livejournal.com]

I have nothing nice to say about Khanken's sense of business, so all I'll say is, beware very warranted.
Glad you won the dispute too! Go you :)

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

Thank you!

[tealmoonxiv.livejournal.com]

That's just gross.

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

Just letting everyone know I have updated the beware with more caps as well as the claim, dispute and paypal resolution. As of now the client has 2/3 commissions completed. The 3rd commission is being rendered. An will be posted in bulk with everyone else on my commission list.

[kasuned.livejournal.com]

So glad this was posted. I've had problems with this guy myself and he's just... so rude.
Beware well warranted.

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

Sorry he has caused you trouble.

I'm starting to hear a lot from people speaking up to me about their experience with him so this wasn't a one time thing with this client. It seems many have had issues. I hope this A_B helps.

[cyiakanami.livejournal.com]

Oh gosh, that's just deplorable! Beware for sure. Blocked and black listed. Thanks for posting this.

[norala.livejournal.com]

Thank you!

[thaily.livejournal.com]

Wow, says he NEEDS money to buy a new dog because his old one died? It's not a laptop >:|
I'm not even sure how that is supposed to inspire sympathy, it's too reprehensible. And after the "DIS CHAR B MIEN STOP DRAWRING EET!" armchair copyright lawyer stunt the mere attempt to guilt you is laughable.

Beware well earned and blocked. This guy is ridonkulous.

[pinstripedtiger.livejournal.com]

Oh that whole thing is just gross, saying he's okay with you finishing the pieces but slapping you with a chargeback like that, then throwing in the details of his dog dying and what I feel is probably a sarcastic "sorry if this inconveniences you."

I can't believe someone would pull that kind of stuff over such wonderful art.

Preemptively blocked.

[ninkit.livejournal.com]

Firstly, I'd like to say your art is absolutely gorgeous! I love your style. Regarding Khanken, that's really sad to see. And the comment on the other artist's shout box about you being greedy and not refunding his cancellation... wow. He sounds really impulsive and rude tbh. If someone left that shout on my page I would run for the hills.

Sorry you had to deal with this, beware well warranted and I'll keep an eye out for him!

[khanken.livejournal.com]

I did not demand money from Insomniac, and you are taking those shouts out of context. The issue was truly with offbeatr, who was demanding a $1 verification fee that would have overdrafted my bank account by $30 at the time. Also, you only completed my last two commissions as far as a colored sketch, and refused to negotiate a partial refund at all.

As a buyer, I was within my right to bring in Paypal to investigate. They found you in favor of the dispute, and you keep the money whether you draw the commission or not. So you are not even obligated to continue the work, despite my disapproval of it.

Personally, I feel that the work you did does not even represent the quality displayed in your Furaffinity ad. It looks rushed and the anatomy is not of the same caliber I expected.

I have actually paid a lawyer a small fee to consider seeking legal action, but they have advised me that legal action is not worth seeking due to international borders and ambiguous laws even within my own country.

Effectively, "asmtsm," I feel that you have seriously ripped me off. But I am unable to seek out legal help for this and unwilling to gather proof against you because I do not believe in harming an artist's reputation over an amount as small as $80, because they deserve the benefit of the doubt and a chance to make a living.

Furthermore, I have issued a genuine apology to kasune through one of his kind and understanding friends for the incident within his journal, which he has consciously declined.


I find this mud slinging after winning a paypal dispute to be an act of being a sore loser. I was genuinely unsatisfied as a customer, and I am offended that some one would demand that I dig up my dog, who was my best friend for ten years, as proof my shetland sheepdog, a breed that costs $300-$1200, is dead.

I am willing to drop this matter entirely and move on, because I have much better things to do than try to defend my reputation from people who have nothing against me except for personal grudges.

I have not cheated anyone out of money. "asmtsm" still has the money I paid for this work. Therefore, I do not see the logic behind an "artist beware." I can only hope that this ends in both parties coming out unscathed, as I no longer desire conflict of any sort.

[asmtsm.livejournal.com]

The beware was written because of you atrocious attitude. No one has slung any mud on you including me. The caps as well as the journal says it all really. So you pretty much dug your own hole.

The fact you opened a claim after you said you were fine with it continuing as stated here http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/4384187/#cid:32180043 was just shady.

After providing proof to paypal as well as my tos they found me in favor. 2/3 are completed while your 3rd is being rendered. To say I will finish it or not is highly disrespectful.

If you felt that it did not display the quality you should of said something instead of saying they were fun paintings thank you then saying fine ill make do with the others then opening a claim 4 days later while bidding on auctions that were the same amount. It shows you have no problem with lying. which puts your guilt trip email into question as well. Either way your personal life isn't anyone's issue but your own even more so in business.

The only way you are ripped off is if your work was not done at all. I personally hold no grudges but the beware had to be made. Behaviors like this in business is just unnecessary and no one else needs to deal with this.

[o0reika0o.livejournal.com]

Ok, so I've heard most about this and read/looked at some of the images and mostly understand whats going on here. Now I can understand with posting something like this, but saying you aren't attacking Khan when to you and others siding with you it doesn't come across that way, but it can certainly come across that way to him. I happen to be an artist myself and Khan is one of my regulars and has commissioned me A LOT and doesn't cancel unless something is seriously wrong. Khan said previously that he was going to only ask for the difference in what you haven't finished. But that doesn't even MATTER anymore so who cares? He's already said you get to keep all the money! So why continue this drama? You don't realize how much drama can hurt people even if its over the internet.

Since this issue has been dealt with this journal/post should just be deleted. You got what you wanted and so worried about, so why continue to pick and ruin someone's reputation? Just because you can? You need to learn when enough is enough...

[tealmoonxiv.livejournal.com]

A_B posts can't be deleted.

And the OP is warning others of their personal bad expirence with the commissioner.

[oceandezignz.livejournal.com]

Well! This is an exciting post.

I will say, that let this be a lesson to everyone. Communication is two-way, and absolutely key in something like commissions. Don't tell the artist that you are HAPPY with something about the work they did for you, when in reality you feel even 5% the opposite of what you're telling them.

Its not going to hurt their feelings (okay it might sting a little, pride is a sensitive backside after all), but what WILL hurt their feelings (and sour the transaction A LOT FASTER than saying you're not satisfied) is pulling a two-timing deal on them. Seriously. Do not treat your artist with smiles and okeydokeys at anytime during the transaction, then turn around and try to slide in a refund via Paypal.

[kasuned.livejournal.com]

A+. I think this is the most important lesson that was to be learned here.

[latiro.livejournal.com]

holy crap, I remember working with this guy! It was for an adoptable I was reselling. He wanted it and when I give him my PayPal address to send $10 to, he sent me this pm

http://oi48.tinypic.com/343q8li.jpg

even so, later on, he sent me $10 for the resell without a hitch

[sigilgoat.livejournal.com]

Wow.

[sigilgoat.livejournal.com]

Like Xai said above, communication with an artist is KEY in these sorts of situations. I wanted to add an experience I had recently to show another way of dealing with this situation that would have not resulted in such a blowup.

Like Khanken, I recently received a commission where I felt the depiction of my character was not what I expected from the artist I commissioned. I spoke to a few trusted friends to see if they felt the same to make sure I wasn't overreacting to a new style, as I hadn't purchased art from this artist before. They agreed that the art both didn't meet the examples I had been shown, and my character looked pretty off model.

I drafted up an email explaining what I felt was off, and a suggested way to change it, along with linking a few more refs (both drawn and a real life Nubian, as they've got pretty specific heads), and the link to the examples I was shown. The artist was obviously a little peeved at me, but agreed to do a re-draw, which was unnecessary to me, since I requested a few small changed, but that's what they wanted to do, so I didn't argue since they also might have a different workflow than me. (Many artists, for example, collapse their layers, making edits more difficult)

It was scary to confront an artist I was unfamiliar with, but I had paid for a specific service, and I didn't feel that's what I received.

I'm not sure why Khanken didn't feel he could do the same, but as a paying customer, you should always let an artist know if you feel they didn't draw your character correctly. I did notice that Khanken linked this ref - https://www.furaffinity.net/view/10014897/ which shows a more muscular body type, when it appears that he prefers a slimmer body type, based on the adoptable he purchased (found here: http://www.furaffinity.net/view/10047714/)

A customer should always make sure they link refs and clarify their expectations to the artist, or the artist has to make those choices themselves, and a customer may not always like the result.

Sorry this got so long, I hope the point I made was clear!

[khanken.livejournal.com]

I believe that I am within my rights to ask that an artist ceases work and attempt to negotiate a partial refund when they have only sketched and hastily flat colored two pieces of art I commissioned them for. In fact, I feel that this artist hastily flat colored the then partially complete works in question to assure avoiding any requests for a refund.

Whether the artist compromises is up to them, but I do not see how my attempting to debate a point, without once cussing and without once actually blowing up until they blocked me and went against my wishes in continuing to draw my character, constitutes an accusation for harassment.

The truth of the matter is that I no longer trusted this artist to even paint a corrected portrait of my character to my satisfaction, and wished for them to cease the work regardless of whether they refunded me or not. Their refusal to negotiate even a partial refund led to me feeling a Paypal claim was necessary.

To be honest, how this artist continues to portray my character personally offends me, especially after I have told them to stop.

[ryunwoofie.livejournal.com]

Wooooow I didn't believe it could get worse but it surely did. Thank you for this beware. They clearly cannot see the light from the hole they dug themself into.

[teekchan.livejournal.com]

After seeing his responses here I will be blocking him. I would not want to work with someone with an attitude like his, with the threat of money being pulled back after work is complete.

I am an artist as well as a commissioner. I have had multiple people ask for changes, and I have done them for them (As long as they comply with my TOS), and I have asked artists for changes in work I have commissioned. It's not hard to do, what so ever.

A simple, "Hey, could you slim him down please? He has a smaller body type.' Or, 'His tail is too thin, would it be a hassle to make it thicker?' would work. Obviously with what you would like changed, these are just example.

[noir-fisheh.livejournal.com]

Defiantly not someone I'd work with for sure. I cannot get passed the attitude. Very warranted.

[timelapsedecay.livejournal.com]

I'm glad he found this beware and came to defend himself.
That way we don't have to tell anyone what he's like, they can just see it.
Sorry you're still going through this, TSM.

[cupcakecreature.livejournal.com]

Wow this is totally unbelievable.
There's so much I don't understand. Didn't he see your gallery & your work before commissioning??? You don't just see an ad on FA & then just commission them... you browse their work, make sure you like it. He also commissioned 2 more things after getting a commission from you previously. Wtf?
A ToS for an artist is protection for them self and to help avoid problems & conflicts between the artist & customer. It's up to the customer to review it. It's like reading reviews & such on Amazon before ordering something... same difference. Just sounds like buyer's remorse & for his own regret (for whatever reason) lashed out at you, Meats. I don't understand how anyone could dislike your work either, truly. I must admit for others, Meats is a good friend of mine, but as she knows I always view situations like this from both sides. I could be biased but it doesn't matter, his attitude & behavior does it all.

The whole thing is just gross. And to use his pet's death as a way to wiggle some guilt into you. Really? Apparently he has "an easy way" to make $80 so why even bring up the dog & getting a new one if money is so easy to obtain?

Just... yikes. Thanks for posting this, Meats. I'm so sorry you have to deal with this.

[tealmoonxiv.livejournal.com]

Doesn't matter if you're biased at this point.
Just look at some of the comments he's left here.