AWFUL commissioner: Citrius

[makichi.livejournal.com]

After a pretty disgusting and uncalled for comment was made on a design commission I had completed, I felt it absolutely necessary to make this post.

I took this character design commission a few months ago and recently completed it. The way I work is by asking for your "must haves" and then working around them.

I have to admit, I knew something was up and that this girl had a little bit of a special snowflake syndrome when she had someone else note me about her commission. She requested that she send the money VIA snail-mail (I almost never accept this method, but she seemed dead set on this commission and it seemed like it meant a lot to her) and it arrived after quite a bit of a wait. But the notes had already started pouring in. Almost constant "Is it there yet? Is it there yet?" Seemed sort of okay to me, though lightly obsessive. I'd be worried about my money too.

But then this guy gave me a NOVEL of a note detailing every single aspect of this girl's being. All of her friends writing a few paragraphs for her and other insane stuff. I thought it was a little bit bonkers, but it didn't really keep me from beginning work after I had the cash. I started off with this sketch here. And as you can see in her comment, she seemed really happy about it. But the note she sent me afterward said otherwise. She started nitpicking my anatomy, and wanting things done like a perfectionist. None of it was good enough. It was slightly annoying, but I went with it. I studied up a little on bear anatomy and came up with this.

I really wanted to be sure that the markings would be okay. She said this was JUST FINE. Everything "thrilled and excited" her, apparently. Her friends kept nitpicking me. And some even noted me. Frequently. She also felt it necessary to tell me EVERY single comment that she received by posting MY art to other sites. I felt like she was putting all of this on display and letting people openly criticize me. At times it felt she was ASKING them to come and bother me because she was to scared to do it herself. It was unpleasant to say the least.

So time passed and I finally got the time to sit down and complete the work. I showed her a WIP. It wasn't good enough. And you know, I understand a commissioner wanting a tweak or two, but she was wanting a re-do a lot of things we had already gone over. She was expecting the markings to "be more complex" even though I had already shown her the markings and she had previously approved. She hated the colors, she wanted the braid "moved behind the ear" (wtf, like it wasn't there to start with) and screwed around with. I told her that if she kept making these adjustments it'd cost her. I realized that this girl was NOT going to be happy if I just went with the flow and designed things without her input to verify that she liked them. Like I usually do. Not to mention she openly compared my art to Ellakins's, showing me her art and saying "I want the markings to be like this, blahblah like her's".

So I came up with a new color palette: http://www.colourlovers.com/palette/457246/Bears

She approved. I came up with different flowers because the ones she selected were fugly. I chose these: http://infomotions.com/gallery/ucla/Images/DSCN7183.jpg

She changed the feathers to kookaburras because I insisted that the Rainbow Lorikeet feathers clashed with his current colors. Cool.

I came up with new markings and shared them with her asking for her approval before I began colors: http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y180/Makime/dunewip2.jpg

I did a rough color and asked her if she liked the markings and color placement: http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y180/Makime/duneexample1.jpg

I stayed polite and professional while she acted like the jerk who harasses a waitress over and over again until they're finally satisfied. And I didn't even get a 50 cent tip. Well, she was finally satisfied. So I thought.

And then this happened: http://comments.deviantart.com/1/91838550/784092354

Blood shot through my eyes, I promise you. Firstly because I know Citrius told her what we had discussed and likely told her to make this comment. Secondly because she's dead wrong and I haven't been treated with such disrespect since I worked in catering. We're now trying to finalize her commission so I can get on with my life.

So artists, do beware. This girl's money is NOT worth the time, harassment, and general emotional discomfort you'll experience. She's the worst commissioner I've EVER had. It's ridiculous how much stress she and her posse will put on you. Take my advice and just avoid this girl.

Comments

[cassu-bean.livejournal.com]

Oh wow, I feel so sorry for you. I guess to try and stop people from getting to re-do things too much before you start a commission you could say something like, 'if you want x amount of re-dos it will cost you x much' or something.
T be honest I applaud you for your composure given the situation.

[makichi.livejournal.com]

It certainly has been a challenge to keep my cool.

And yes, I informed her that it would start costing her if she kept demanding re-do's and complaining about everything. But I guess I'll have to learn to lay that out there from the start.

[wyna-hiros.livejournal.com]

Good lord, sounds like a pain in the ass!

In the future, maybe have a policy of "ONCE YOU APPROVE SOMETHING, THERE ARE NO CHANGES TO IT" or "ONCE YOU APPROVE SOMETHING< THERE ARE NO CHANGES TO IT AFTER A CERTAIN STAGE". (Like her wanting different markings after she already approved them)

[makichi.livejournal.com]

Yes, I plan on doing that more strictly in the future. It was certainly a learning experience...

[nerdlover.livejournal.com]

Ugh thats insane. Your work is gorgeous, this girl just seems like she was not going to be satisfied no matter how much work you put into it..

I hope this doesnt get you down to much about commissioners.

Slightly off topic but where do you usually announce when you're open for commissions again?

[nerdlover.livejournal.com]

Also you use OC to do coloring and inking or just inking? Your technique is quite spiffy and better than what I usually do.

[makichi.livejournal.com]

Umm... usually after I'm mostly done, if i'm up to it. And for the other comment, yes I ink in OC. Colors are in photoshop. :D

[paulownia.livejournal.com]

I can understand your frustration. To go through all that and have your work belittled is very insulting.

I think one suggestion I might make for the future is to not be "too too " open publicly in posting commission WIPs at DA unless you are prepared for a literal peanut gallery to get involved.

Just an observation on your initial posts. You came across a bit tentative and admitted this was your first bear. That might give people the impression that you are completely open to taking comments from everywhere and "new at this." And once the comments came in, everyone else probably felt it was okay to do jump on in. There might be ways to avoid that, by simply just posting it was a WIP and disabling comments.

For the future, it might be worthwhile to limit revisions somehow. Like state upfront that you are willing to do one tweak after the initial sketch has been agreed to, but after that, you may want to think about drawing the line.

Unfortunately a lot of people in this world are compulsive editors and will never stop unless you set your boundaries.

Sorry you had to go through this, though. It definitely sounds painful.

[makichi.livejournal.com]

Thank you for the advice! I'll certainly keep information for the public to a minimum in the future. But in her case, she was posting what we had discussed to forums. Dx

[paulownia.livejournal.com]

That doesn't surprise me at all. I wouldn't even put it past her to have created troll accounts to pester you at DA either... just take the advice more generally for other situations and hopefully none will ever get this weird o_O

[thaily.livejournal.com]

"I think one suggestion I might make for the future is to not be "too too " open publicly in posting commission WIPs at DA unless you are prepared for a literal peanut gallery to get involved. "

The commissioner was apparently reposting the work herself though and forwarding the comments she received there back to the artist. I usually post my WIPs at a private url but if my customers behaved like that it wouldn't help much :/

[freudian-lisp.livejournal.com]

Fucking shituck! Lawd! ASS!

My condolences :I

[dreamerwolf856.livejournal.com]

Just wow... Thanks for the warning!

[makichi.livejournal.com]

Maybe in the future. I'm currently swamped. Glad you like my work, though!

[china-kitty.livejournal.com]

I am sorry to hear that had happened to you as I could relate.

[hollowzero.livejournal.com]

Thank you for this, I haven't heard a horror story like this in a while.

[airukitsu.livejournal.com]

Serious, thank you for warning. This girl sounds like a spoiled brat. I almost want her to commission me just to tell her off when she gets out of line. I would not have put up with that, man, kudos for your patience.

On another note. I should watch you

[maui-dolphin.livejournal.com]

No Sir I don't like it. :P

[the-lest.livejournal.com]

off topic but i really like your icon! :)

[spotqueen.livejournal.com]

I could NOT do that. You poor thing, you must have the patience of a saint!

I would have gotten frustraited and told her to STFU and deal with it, and then never be commissioned ever again...*single tear*

Thanks for the warning. What a brat.

[nambroth.livejournal.com]

Ye gods.

I had this happen before... not so severe, but similarly. Now I request full details beforehand so I know just how much to ask for, depending on how inane and anal descriptions are. I also set a number of revisions and after that there is a charge. :/

Also, you do damn fine work! Beautiful.

[makichi.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that's the challenge with design work. I'm just not sure how everything will play out so I have a base price and ask for more when the complexity rises. It's pretty hit and miss. I don't think I'll be taking design commissions in the future.

She not only didn't pay for the complexity, she also changed everything ridiculously. All in all, I was overworked and underpayed.

[dinogrrl.livejournal.com]

Man :/ I would have dropped her like a hot potato. If not for her attitude, then for those of her friends. WTF? A commission is between you and the client alone. I would have told her to get her friends to back off, or she can take her business elsewhere.

I'm a staunch supporter of the 'three re-dos of a sketch, additional re-dos cost X' and the 'once sketch is finalized, there will be NO MORE CHANGES' policies. They'll save your skin in situations like this.

[uneide.livejournal.com]

... you have the patience of a saint, is all I have to say.
Thank you for the heads up, and gorgeous image ( both of them! )

[oceandezignz.livejournal.com]

*offers chocolate, hugs and a tazer*

I will happily avoid that person like the plague~ and anyone else like her. >:

[kiriska.livejournal.com]

God, you have amazing patience. I would have just refunded her ass and moved on with my life. :( You deserve a medal for that kind of professionalism. <3

[frisket17.livejournal.com]

seconded. o_o

[neongryphon.livejournal.com]

I have just recently had a similar bad experience to this, but not to that degree. I had a very demanding picky buyer who wanted the anatomy of his character exactly so. I worked very closely from the mountains of photos refs I was continuously sent, but still he kept changing the pose and criticising the anatomy, even after originally approving it. When he went so far as to rub out my version and draw his own hideous anatomically incorrect rendition – with every limb a different colour to point out my ‘ineptitude’ – I become flustered and distressed. I refunded him for work not done and won’t be accepting work from him again. Very disappointing and upsetting.

I suggest you lay down a ToS - Three minor alterations to a sketched image, or you charge extra. Pose redraws also attract an extra charge, as do complete recolours.

[makichi.livejournal.com]

OH JEEZ. I don't understand why these people commission you if they don't like your anatomy.

I like that ToS. Muchly.

[tehjos.livejournal.com]

Holy shit. I'm so sorry you had to deal with that... I can't understand why she was so fucking picky anyway, your work is gorgeous!

[hitchhyena.livejournal.com]

People like this think their character is Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious and has to be done PERFECT or els it SUCKS.

Sorry you had to deal with a person that's like that.

[ellonwye.livejournal.com]

Just had to comment to say that both the finished commission and that initial abandoned sketch are fabulous, I love bears. :)

[maui-dolphin.livejournal.com]

Geez :(
I personally like the first design more.

[anjel-kitty.livejournal.com]

Wow I would be wary of not just her but her peanut gallery as well. I mean really the amount of harassment they put you through was just unacceptable.
Thanks for the heads up

[rs-studios.livejournal.com]

great art! crappy comissioner.

I always show reference to what my character looks like. offer a coupple sugesstions on pose. and let the artist do their thing. i am always happy with what i get:)

I am always about " what the artist sees" rather then " what i want the artist to see" i always get way better drawings then i expect:)

[zoom-gas.livejournal.com]

my condolences. good god.
i'm sorry :(

[thaily.livejournal.com]

Wow.

This is why I state that I will only do business with the commissioner and not their friends, family, milk man, dentist, third cousin twice removed..
Her "friends" had no say in the process, especially not the latter comment if you put so much into the work because the commissioner didn't know what she wanted.

[thaily.livejournal.com]

The work is gorgeous by the way, not sure how much she paid for it but considering everything she put you through and the still awesome results, it probably wasn't enough.

[unclekage.livejournal.com]

I work at a contract laboratory. When I prepare protocols for clients I include the following statement:

A draft report will be delivered... The client will have 20 working days to respond with comments, after which time the report will be finalized if no comments are received. The client will be permitted a maximum of two revisions to the draft report; additional charges may be incurred for further revisions.

Maybe artists need to have a contract with each commissioner that includes that language.

[frisket17.livejournal.com]

That's an extremely nice clause. Frankly, I agree with you that artists would do well to have a contract (or at least TOS) of similar content.

Thank you kindly for posting that.

[megumi-kitten.livejournal.com]

The way that last comment sounded...than Cit created BEARS. WOW That must be SO cool to be able to design and take credit to a SPECIES!

Sorry...the sarcasm couldn't contain itself.


One thing that hit me was the fact she was dead set on mailing you the money. Maybe as a way to 'cemenet' her commish, so that if you refused in the end from all this crap (and I have ALOT less patience than you!) then she could pull a "You never mailed my money back!" or "It was lost in the mail" Or something.

I'm so pessimistic and think the worst of everyone though. D:

[the-lest.livejournal.com]

You were really patient and worked hard despite all the crap you got. Admirable! Also, the artwork was really lovely. I don't see why she had a problem with it, because even the beginning sketched looked fantastic to me. But, for the record and maybe to help in future, I think theres one or two ways which you could have handled the situation better.

Like someone else said, posting the WIPs to a public site is a bad idea. In fact, I NEVER post any part of a commission, WIP or complete, without first getting from the commissioner their approval that the picture is okay, and their permission. For a start I just think its rude to post a commission without permission from the person who paid for it. (I'm not sure if I'm alone in this though) and secondly, you can avoid this kind of crap that got flung at you (or at least cut down on it).

Secondly, the way you responded to the comment here http://comments.deviantart.com/1/91838550/784092354 was not very professional. You had your feelings hurt, you were insulted, and it shows. You have every right to feel angry or upset - that person made really uncalled-for and well, downright thick comments - but you can rise above it, and just respond in a polite and matter of fact way. show them that you are bigger and better than them. You took on a really defensive tone and showed kandee-cane that they had succeeded in their attempt to upset you. Was there any need to start your reply with "WTF. Do you have ANY idea?" which shows everyone how annoyed you are? You could just say "thanks for your input, but you seem to be under a misunderstanding, here's how it actually happened" and then just explain what you explained calmly and without the attitude you showed. I'm not saying you have a bad attitude or you were wrong to take that attitude or anything, by all means i'm sure we can all sympathise with how you feel! you were really pushed about and treated badly through all of this. But if you can rise above it and show people that their attempts to rile you up won't work, you'll command more respect and for the most part they'd back off. I just hope kandee-cane doesn't retaliate (because the way you retaliated opens the door for even more rudeness from kandee-cane)

i hope that helps and sorry if I seemed a bit preachy, but thats what i honestly think.

[makichi.livejournal.com]

I don't think my comment was un-professional. She was an outsider.

[frisket17.livejournal.com]

Dear god. There comes a time where you say enough, refund, and tell them to GTFO. I read over the entire thing, and I give you credit dear, you put up with way more than I would have.

I thank you deeply for posting about this, too. :/ Nice to be warned who the nutter butters are out there. Yeesh.

Frankly, the original color pallet of the brown bear was prettier than the second color pallet she wanted. But whatever, right? ;)

Take care hon and good luck to you.

[digivolution.livejournal.com]

what a jerk >>

[copperfur.livejournal.com]

OMG
Can I say something here?
Your prices are WAY to low for the quality of work you are offering, I charge about 80$ and Up for a tricked out ref sheet and I've seen artists worse then you charge even more! And they are filled with commissions! You look like you take awhile on your work, you put in careful planning and you go through this crap. Your commissions are all lovingly put together with time and care, you DESERVE much more. Don't sell yourself short =3 BELIEVE me, people will still commission you even if you raise the prices a little, we artists gotta eat you know O_O????

[makichi.livejournal.com]

Thank you! I'm glad you think my art is that good. I'm not sure if I wanna raise prices just yet (or if I'll even take commissions anytime soon). But I'll certainly think about your words. :D