Demanding Commissioner

[sakarataryn.livejournal.com]

The commissioner I am nearly done with now is quite well known within the fandom(Or he appears to be to me), however, on the occasions we've had to speak for business I have found him very...challenging, for me to personally work with. Now I will admit that I feel more stress due to anxiety problems(Basically my reaction to stress or nervousness is out of proportion), but I don't think I can work with this person.



Now this guy pays appropriately and on time, he also refrains from nagging about 'Is it done yet?'. He paid half in advance for a one character, basic background commission that was largely up to me for details and pose and was to be all digital without any kind of print. All he wanted was the .PSD file.

I have spent the last TWO HOURS tweaking this maddening document. 1) First he complained about the theme of the image and the static pose, after -he specifically- approved it. He said this out of the blue after noting that I was the third person to do it. 2) Then he tells me he's pleased with the image anyway(?). 3) Then he wants some parts of the image tweaked for brightness, which I oblige even though I do think at a certain point one should trust artists discretion, even if you would've chosen another color. Thankfully this is easy to change in photoshop... 4) When I mention that if the image appears dark, that he may wish to brighten his monitor. Mine is set brighter than some to match my printer and I do not currently know of a way to ensure an image looks the same on all monitors. He randomly implies that he has some monitor calibration device that fixes his monitor automatically. I'm not sure what this means, until I realize it implies his monitor is already perfect. He then mentions I should invest in this $150 device that I cannot afford, that I also wouldn't buy right now anyway since that could get me more immediately useful things. I find this rude as well. 5) After two hours, I note that I will continue our incredibly long attempts at transfering this PSD over the internet. I've cut down file sizes for him, tried zipping, several file transfer sites, his iDisk, none of which work. He doesn't want to let me go to bed despite me saying I will go back at the issue tomorrow(It's nearly ten for me) and he also will not accept a CD mailed at no cost to him. 6) About the 'I don't want a CD' thing...he had said that would be fine in the beginning, when I made note before taking his money that I did not know of any other good way to transfer PSDs. Oi.


Now, I'm not sure if any of these things are worth naming him to this community, it may just be that I don't handle that kind of customer well. I do not intend to ever take work from him again however due to the immense frustration I've experienced and the extremely minimal feedback. I'm not sure however what a polite way to turn down work from a single individual is, especially if they press the issue with 'But your commissions are open!' or 'You offered one to JoeSchmoe!'. Does this community have any tips for dealing with people like these or kindly turning them elsewhere?

EDIT: In light of enlightening and helpful discussion here, if this customer(Ksilebo) cannot be happy with a flattened PSD(He desires PSD over JPEG as they are lossless; I also agreed to giving him this full-resolution format), then I will kindly consider the work closed and that it will be his choice whether or not to pay the second half of his work. I don't depend on my art for a living and I can afford to cut this one loss and consider it a big learning experience. I think I have taken adequate measures for this customer(Obeying his detail rules, providing sketches and finalizing them before work starts, providing him with a full size and resolution JPEG) and I don't want to compromise myself for money that isn't worth it.

Thanks muchly for everyone's thoughts, especially the information about why not to give out PSDs. I feel better knowing better.

Comments

[rah-bop.livejournal.com]

I would love to know this commissioner's name, because I have had customers like this and as soon as I'm half-way through I think "I wish I had never taken this commission!" So, I would appreciate it if I knew in advance who to not bother with!

I'm looking forward to hearing from other people who have experience refusing customers, because I haven't had to do it so far.

[sakarataryn.livejournal.com]

He is 'Ksilebo' and can be found on Deviantart. He's commissioned...an almost insane number of hexdragon themed images.

[kiriska.livejournal.com]

"Though you may not have known or noticed, but I don't think our previous transaction went too well. I felt [1], [2], and [3]. I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to pass on this commission. I hope you understand."

I've been able to shove 800MB+ files over AIM, though I guess jittery connections will mess that up. Sites like yousendit and mediafire also work well. What kind of problems have you been having? D:

[sakarataryn.livejournal.com]

The main problem at first for me was jittery internet coupled with a bitchy router and firewall. Then I went from a wireless connection to a steady, wired cable connection and apparently HIS internet is now crap. I succeeded today in uploading it to senduit.com, but my commissioner apparently just doesn't have the stable connection to download it.

[aerinl.livejournal.com]

Good lord why are you sending him the PSD?

I wouldn't recommend doing that unless your working freelance with a contract written up. It's... not a good idea o___o

[immortalpanda.livejournal.com]

THIS

sending a .psd sends up big huge red flags.

[tealizard.livejournal.com]

THIS. I only ever send high res jpgs; EVER

[sakarataryn.livejournal.com]

What makes you say this? The idea that he will reprint the image(Which I should think he could easily do as well with a full-size jpeg)? Or something else?

[snobahr.livejournal.com]

I'm okay with sending a PSD, m'self. It'd have the layers flattened, but it'd still be a PSD...

[taasla.livejournal.com]

I agree with the above poster. You could easily send him the max resolution .jpg. It works just as well.

[anjel-kitty.livejournal.com]

Yeah about the PSP thing.. I would have been suspcious about that from the get go. Why does he want it in .psd format? Does he want to change it when he gets it? And what with all the difficulty with your connection and his, why wouldn't he just accept it in a high res JPG. I would ask him why he MUST have it in Psd.
But yeah 2 hours is nothing with a picky commissioner. I've had some that nitpick me about things that have taken me days. Hence the reason I'm adopting the "If I make x amount of changes, you have to pay me more" policy. I recommend doing the same

[sakarataryn.livejournal.com]

I just found out his reasoning and I do think it's semi-sound. He thankfully is happy with a flattened out version of the image; the reason he wanted PSD instead of JPEG is because PSD files are lossless, whereas JPEGS always have some kind of noise or distortion.

...I STILL think it's picky as hell, but I already know not to work with him again.

[vulturekisses.livejournal.com]

Echoing the people asking why he wants the PSD, I'd say make a separate file, flatten it, and THEN send it to him that way. ;) He gets the PSD he wants, but none of the layers or stuff that makes it easy for him to change. And the file size would be smaller as well, and sendable to him.

[chronidu.livejournal.com]

I am very glad that I saw this, being a high anxiety person as well I try to avoid exceptionally high stress clients, and he had been coming to me wanting to commission further more hexidragons. This guy has commissioned literately countless people for these dragons in their own design... I can't help but wondering what he's looking to do with them all...

[meradragon.livejournal.com]

he's commissioned me before, and I took it no problem, because I never heard any complaints. Well, he actually worked perfectly with me, and never had any problem with anything I showed him.

HOWEVER, I still haven't received payment for my last image. I was a dumbutt, and sent it over, because I never heard any problems before and assumed if so many people commissioned him, and he wasn't good at paying, that it would have come up before.

I'm going to bother him again, soon, but my waiting time for payment of a completed commission is really a month. I can say that it took me a lot longer to finish it than I originally planned, but that was in part because he sort of... SURPRISE paid me in the first place when I wasn't really ready. (my fault, again), but I was actually starting to contemplate a post here if I didn't get payment :/

[saeto15.livejournal.com]

I sent him the file in advance, too, though only in a low res .jpg until he paid. Took him two months, but he finally came through with the money. Just bug the hell out of him.

[redrumwolf.livejournal.com]

i see many ppl have probs with him!
Someone shuld go and point out this to him, and how many go 'ok he's horrible!'
perhaps he doesnt realize it himself?

[ksilebo.livejournal.com]

I'm hearing it now, and I'm going to resolve it.

[meradragon.livejournal.com]

I feel like making the notation that I spoke to him today by sending a note stating that he's had a month and that I would like payment within two weeks and that if he couldn't make it, to give me a concrete date" No threats, just a perfectly reasonable statement. ANd he paid me right away.

Otherwise, with the commission, as I said before, he was easy to work with for myself. I showed a few sketches, and asked what he desired, and kept working with it. The only thing he was demanding about (to say, hah) was about some corrections that were really quick to work on the toes.

But now, since I've heard from other people (including someone before this) that he might be hard to get payment out of... maybe the truth is that you just need to put your foot down and say exactly what you want, too. Don't worry if you sound "pushy" as it's all in professional interest... of both parties, really.

So, all in all, I can just conclude that he might work differently with different artists.

[freudian-lisp.livejournal.com]

I've done a commission for Ksilebo in the past and never had any problems with him. We discussed what I'd draw, I made a few very rough skethces, worked on the one he approved of and refined it-- I don't think he picked very much on that and it would have been understandable if he did anyway, since I said he could

I finished the image, told him I was done, got my money and sent over a marginally smaller, flattened .PSD version of the file

I write this because the dude you are talking about sounds like an entirely different person to me (though I don't know him very well personally). I wouldn't hesitate to do another commission if he asked me and I was open, but it's cool to let people know about bad commissioners and not just bad artists

[the-lest.livejournal.com]

Perhaps your artwork/style is more compatiable with the type of thing he wants.

I'm not saying the OP, or any of the other people who he has commissioned, is a bad artist, but maybe it just so happened that when he gave you the details, you were able to nail them on the head straight away, whereas others weren't able to simply because of differences in the way they work :\ and it's pot luck whether he gets a commissioner who works the way he likes, or doesn't.

Since there's a lot of posts on this community where people step up and say "I've never had a problem with X commissioner", I reckon that type of thing happens a lot

[saeto15.livejournal.com]

I've done three commissions for him so far, and haven't had any problems other than him being really picky. The first two paintings he paid for promptly, though the third took him about two months to come up with the money, and he threw in an extra $20 for waiting.

I think the payment issue is mostly a case of losing track of how many people he's commissioned, and how much he owes. Then again, I am giving the benefit of the doubt since I've never had any problems with him.

[kesame.livejournal.com]

i've done a ton of commissions in the last year and a half, but he's the _only_ one i had to cancel due to customer-related issues. that's all i'll say~

[airukitsu.livejournal.com]

I do commissions for him all the time, and I talk to him on a regular basis. I have had no serious problems with him and my rules are much stricter then that (I require all payment up front, and I usually take a little while to do the work, I am also kind of absent minded and tend to mess up PSD files or compress them wrong, yet he has always been patient and understanding). When he first commissioned me and we didn't know eachother very well he was a little frustrating, but nothing I couldn't patiently handle. As you work with him longer you realize that people misunderstand his personality with him conciously being a pushy ass hole. If he is making you uncomfortable or annoying you, just tell him. He is a big boy he can handle it. A lot of times I very angrilly tell him to not do something and he takes it pretty well and will still want art from me with no hard feelings.

Some File Format comments

[armaina.livejournal.com]

Hey a general thought on PSD's there are other High res alternatives. For one, a flattened PSD can save tons of room and still be the same res.

Personally, all my digital files will be .TIFF This is a file that is high res and specifically intended for printing which is exactly what the commissioner will need. They do not need a PSD with all it's separate layers, no way no how. Your second option is a PNG however I've had some issues with the colors changing when saved as a PNG.

Also about refusing his commissions. Tell him you don't want to take a commission from him, just flat out. You have the right to turn down a commission.

[neongryphon.livejournal.com]

Not so long ago I had to partially refund someone for work not completed because their expectation became too high and a lot of my time, energy and confidence was eaten away with it. I just went around and around on the line art. I’ve been doing commissions for about 6 years, and that was the only person I ever had to cancel; so whatever you do, don’t take it personally. Some buyer’s just wont be satisfied and will bleed you dry if you let them.
No room for being too nice in business. Have your limits already laid out and when people cross them, charge them extra or cancel the commisison. Just be sure they know the limits, too (like no more than 3 minor alterations for free - no going back on pre-approved poses etc). Have a ToS available for them to read before you start a commission. It stops this sort of thing happening so easily.

[the-lest.livejournal.com]

That isn't fair - a commissioner should be able to have a good idea of what you are capable of when they send you the money - they have your gallery with plenty of examples to view. If they send you the money it means they like your work enough to pay for it. :\

[the-lest.livejournal.com]

I've heard of Ksilebo causing problems for people before...

as for file formats,
I only send .JPG, .PNG and/or .TIFF files. I don't know a lot about the technicalities of it, but I know .JPG generally is used on the internet and doesn't cause viewing problems for anyone with a computer less than 15 years old, and .TIFF as far as I know are one of the best types of files to get a quality print out of, and some people just request .PNG and as far as I can tell there are no problems (presumably they request .PNG because they can't view / don't know about .TIFF)

[ksilebo.livejournal.com]

1/2- I meant that as a "You're the 3rd person to do it, but I liked the way you did it, so I made an exception."

3- I only said it would make the foreground of the image stand out better rather than the background dominate the image. I very often defer to the artist's discretion in these situations, but I did not agree here.

4- I did not mean it to sound like OMG YOU NEED TO BUY THIS PRODUCT but was just saying its a useful tool. I am not sure how my saying this could have come off as rude.

5- You never once said "I need to go" or "I'm tired and need to go to bed." Your tone from our IM conversation seemed like you were trying to get it done as well. There was never a rush and I would never have had held you up. It was only the last line of the conversation where you said something like you were going to try it tomorrow that I gathered you were done trying for the day.

6- I would have found some way get the file, defaulting, finally, to the CD. I didn't know it would have been that much harder than just sending the CD. I recommend it because no one has to go to the post office or pay extra, usually.

As for the PSD thing, I only ever want a flattened PSD. If possible, the BG and foreground/subject laters seperate in case I just want to print the figure and not the background. I don't print these for anyone, and just tile my walls with the digital ones, and frame the real media ones. No example pictures right now because I've moved 3 times in the past 2 years and haven't put the pictures back up on the wall. I have a wide-format printer that I use, and want to be able to manipulate the image so it looks just like it would on the screen onto the paper. To do this, I want the full image (at least Letter/A4 at 300 DPI) in PSD so I get ALL of the information out of the image so I can tweak it. I don't send the image to anyone else, not even a full size of the image in JPG. Due to MY sstress and MY shit day for some reason I never mentioned that a TIFF would have saved her a a lot of stress, and that was my bad.

Also, at the time of this writing, I have no internet at home, and was borrowing a neighbor's wireless as well as the city's wireless ISP. Both of which were having massive levels of fail. I'll have Comcast again tomorrow hopefully.

SO. I apologize you had a bad experience with me, and am more than willing to make it worth your time. Poke me on AIM again when you see me. I want to make this right.

[lilenth.livejournal.com]

Just a note but the "auto calibration" for monitors? There's not a single one that doesn't suck for artwork display. Most of them will set it to general display which displays all things okay but not great. For the best calibration for viewing artwork, hand calibration is needed for most monitors especially flatscreen ones.