Advice please?

[negawolfie.livejournal.com]

Hello everyone I has this issue which has been bothering me for a year. My friend and I work on commissions together and there was this customer who wanted a reference sheet from us. What he asked for was extremely complicated and detailed but thankfully it was completed to his liking. The customer made an agreement with us to not post it, since it was supposed to be a surprise and he would tell us when to post it.

Months flew by and there was seriously no word from him at all, I decided to ask my friends for opinions if my friend could post the old commission into the gallery because as an artist my friend has the right to post despite the agreement made (which that what was told to me). So after my friend posted the reference sheet the customer leaves a shout asking my friend to answer his notes. The guy was clearly upset and mentioned our agreement along with the fact he fears his character idea might get stolen (which is impossible since it has his name on it), so my friend took the image down and we all agreed that we get updated from him which he said he will. Of course our conversation was 3 months ago with no updates at all.

We honestly do not know what to do, like can my friend note him every once in a while or will that upset the guy?

UPDATE: So I sent him a note and got replied with this

AHHH yes, I am very sorry that Yoü have had to go through this pain and having to wait. I sincerely apologize and I hope Yoü are doing well for this year. My suit has been accepted by OneFurAll and will be made soon hopefully. If Yoü could please not post it yet it would be lovely. I would like to know though if Yoü have got your business cards ready so once I receive the suit I can hand your card out.

D: Well I never mentioned a business card and surprisingly his suit is going to be made by OFA which holy crap I didn't think they would accept such a task. So yeah I'm glad he was very apologetic for his lack of updates and such.

Comments

[celestinaketzia.livejournal.com]

In the future when clients request them get a concrete, realistic date for them to set. Do not let a client take your rights from your image without compensating you by dragging on this "you can post it later" on for ages and ages. It's your art. You never sold the right to distribution away via contract.

However in this case, I suggest contacting him again and being firm. Tell him that your original agreement didn't state he could keep the image down indefinitely, and that you two will need a realistic date that you can post it in the near future.

I state realistic so that clients don't tell you "Okay, you can post it January 1st, 2045".

[negawolfie.livejournal.com]

Thank you so much for the advice. My friend and I are still learning about taking in commissions and this right here is a first for us. So because of this I will update the TOS about posting artwork.

I will surely note the guy and see what is going on; the few reasons why he doesn't want it posted as stated he doesn't want his character idea being stolen despite the fact his ref sheet has his name on it, he's trying to get the fursona made into a fursuit who can do the extreme complex tribal tattoo markings that covers about 70% of his body, and the fact it's meant to be a surprise for the suit maker.

On a off topic note I really don't want to work with him on future commissions seeing how he just seemed pushy while working with him, even wrote this comment about the pricing of the ref sheet which was $57

"Umm okay wow lol lot more then I expected but ok, if you could just wait til payday (Wednesday) if that's ok I'd be more then happy to send it also could you send me wip pics but don't post it on FA til final product if that's ok?"

Mind you the ref sheet was originally suppose to be 4 view body image with close ups of items and such. I had to refund him a portion of the money due to my friend not being able to make a 4th view. He agreed with the change and was extremely happy with the results.

[vauvakolibri.livejournal.com]

"doesn't want his character idea being stolen despite the fact his ref sheet has his name on it"
To be fair, having a name in the art won't prevent anyone from stealing the character idea.
Though I'm bit side-eyeing the "surprise for the suit maker", as in, is he trying to make the suit commission seem simpler and then tack on the fact that the character has difficult markings?

[gatekat.livejournal.com]

Very much agreed. I'd give him no more than 3 more months. You've already given him may more than a reasonable amount of time.

[fuzibuni.livejournal.com]

Yeaaaah as a suit maker this would upset me... an extremely complex character would NOT be a nice surprise after we settled on a price.

[thaily.livejournal.com]

It's also possible he stole the design from someone else and is worried about getting caught if the commission was posted.

[frisket17.livejournal.com]

This crossed my mind as well. I've seen it happen.
Someone commissions others for artwork, and they're like.. The hell. This doesn't belong to X person, it belongs to Y person.

[celestinaketzia.livejournal.com]

This is something I thought of, too. The only time I've had clients be insistent on having a commission private is because they were commissioning characters they shouldn't have.

[negawolfie.livejournal.com]

o~o Now that you point that out that is very sketchy...
I mean he said it was like a character revamp of his old one, still kinda looks the same but with the extreme complex of the tribal markings.

He is friends with Dexter Young and mods her fursuit page. That right there was a red flag for me but I didn't think too much of it since he and Dexter is not the same people. Plus he always did pay right away for adopts and this commission.

[tealmoonxiv.livejournal.com]

That's what I was thinking.

Mod Comment

[arphalia.livejournal.com]

Hello! :) I'm going to screen your comment with the link to the ref sheet for the time being. I know you censored out the name but the ref may still point out who it is, which isn't something we allow with advice posts. (Gonna run it by other mods when they're around, just in case I'm being overly cautious.)

Re: Mod Comment

[negawolfie.livejournal.com]

:c Oh I'm terribly sorry for that I didn't know.

Re: Mod Comment

[arphalia.livejournal.com]

No worries! I could tell you were trying to keep the identity hidden by censoring the name. :)

[tealmoonxiv.livejournal.com]

What does "surprise for the fursuit maker" mean?
Does he think he can get a certain price and then later show up with super complex markings?

[teekchan.livejournal.com]

Tell him if he wants the image to remain unposted, it would require a fee. Otherwise get a firm date of when you can post it. Generally when people ask this it's usually a week or two, a month at most. Usually for a gift or something.

[thaily.livejournal.com]

He didn't buy you out of your redistribution rights, and you've given him a more than generous courtesy period for surprising.. Whoever they wanted to surprise. Just post it, and if he complains, ask him to buy out your rights which are easily 2-300% of the commission price.

[everainsley]

Shoot, stupid phone replied to the wrong thread.

[celestinaketzia.livejournal.com]

Screened it for you.

[everainsley]

Thank you.

[silvertales.livejournal.com]

I'm definitely with everyone stating that he didn't buy the rights to your work, and three months is above and beyond reasonable. If he wants the image kept private indefinitely, then he's welcome to pay you for the rights (easily 300% of the original commission, or more) and you'll be happy to keep it down. Otherwise, your work is your resume, and and you have the right (unless agreed upon beforehand - which it wasn't in this case) to display your work.

Granted, this wasn't stipulated in your TOS when he commissioned you and your friend, so he does have the upper hand, really... *but* that said, he's being unreasonable by not, at least, giving you some kind of feasible deadline to work with.

This sounds kind of shady all around, really... if nothing else gets resolved, I'd definitely not work with this guy in the future.

[magicporpoise.livejournal.com]

Sorry if you answered this question already, but did he ask to keep it offline before or after you made it for him?

If it was after, I would find it unfair, only because you may have had a choice of not doing it if he stated this, and you wouldnt have had to deal with it.

I personally would set a date, he cant keep you from posting it, and there is nothing wrong with you actually posting it, maybe upsetting him, but thats it. It's frustrating when a client thinks they have control over what you do with YOUR work. Whether it be private or not, you have that right, not him.