Commissioner Beware - Recca_Sen_Li

[maxx attax]

WHO: Recca_sen_li

WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/reccasenli

WHAT: He commissioned a digital two-character commission.

WHEN: Started March 28, 2014. Ended January 24th.

EXPLAIN: First, I want to say that I own my mistakes. Around the time this commission initiated my husband was in and out of the hospital (until October) and having multiple surgeries which left me as the main provider of our house on top of having to cover his hospital bills. I took on too much work and managed to over-burden myself (a mistake which I have been rectifying by focusing on my oldest queued commissions and only taking one new slot per every 2-3 finished off of my queue). First set of notes about the commission: http://i.imgur.com/cQvsTEg.png

Today I noticed I got a few new watchers, which usually happens when I upload something or one of my commissioners has. So I checked my most recent posted pictures to see who uploaded something, and saw that it was him. I went to his page and saw this: http://i.imgur.com/nG1B24T.png

Screenshot is cropped, here's the actual link (NSFW) (he also hid my comment saying that I did tell him I could refund him): http://www.furaffinity.net/view/15648598/

I was slightly hurt and upset by this, I've been working extremely hard to fix my past mistakes (I've cleared at least 20 backlogged things off my queue in just the last few weeks) and I had offered to give him a refund if he didn't want to wait. Both times he said he would rather have the art (and I acknowledged I would rather do the art because I liked the characters involved).

Notes from him about a refund: http://i.imgur.com/AF5S7lj.png (the apology referred to is because he left a very rude comment on one of my journals and I told him to note me about a refund.)

My husband was still in and out of the hospital at this time, and so I ended up sidetracked (again, I admit this is a good deal my fault).

Email about a refund, and apparently him keeping tabs on what I have uploaded and blatantly lieing (I have NOT done any commission streams since once nearly two years ago, proof: http://www.furaffinity.net/view/10601957/ this was the ONLY time) and never any PWYW streams, and I only held ONE free art contest that was around the same time, right before my husband was hospitalized). He also made the statement that he wanted the art AND a refund, which was when I heavily considered refunding him regardless because that got under my skin but the art was already inked and half colored by that point.

http://i.imgur.com/xWs1NcH.png
http://i.imgur.com/gjby1XC.png

I had finished the commission about two days later (as he was next in my list for catching up).


I would just like to say, again, that I know that a big part of this is my fault and I am owning my mistakes and trying to make things right. But I found his behavior underhanded and unprofessional.

(Screenshots have been fixed, I hope this is the right way to post OTL.)

Comments

mod note

[celestinaketzia.livejournal.com]

Howdy!

While I was getting this approved your duplicate post came in. This is the older one, so if you have an update to this post feel free to update it accordingly.

Edit: Also, his email must be censored from here, too:
http://i.imgur.com/qJ1yQxb.png

Re: mod note

[matsiwolf.livejournal.com]

Been over a week and that email still isn't censored out, just thought you should know.

[celestinaketzia.livejournal.com]

Commenting as a member now, I suppose.

I've done work for Recca and enjoyed it immensely. I understand his frustration on having to wait a very long time for a piece, but my jaw utterly hit the floor at his attempt to get both the art and the refund.

He's right in that I'm sure he's well known, but now I'm always going to remember him as that one guy who attempted to blackmail an artist. =\

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

I take full responsibility for falling so behind, and I feel so so bad about it.

The email was what first made me debate posting an A_B because that's really...just...wrong to do to someone. But when I saw the submission, that was basically the straw that broke the camel's back.

I really hate confrontation and it's been pretty upsetting.

[recca-husky.livejournal.com]

don't get it twisted now. "blackmail" is a very strong word in this sense.
It's more of there is no "standard" procedure on how to get a refund/what you want.

cause if i go to a tire shop and they have my car for 6 months damn right i want my money back and the work done or they get a bad review on yelp. you know that was the mind set. this was my first time being in this situation with an artist. lesson learned for sure.

[ansitru.livejournal.com]

Yikes, I don't think I would want someone like them to commission me if they're going to use A_B as a way of blackmailing someone into refunding and giving the art.

Not to mention the keywords were kind of .. Childish.

Yes, waiting for such a long time for art sucks. I get that. But then they shouldn't have denied the refund that was offered, imo?

[recca-husky.livejournal.com]

i was trying to give her a chance. I do have some sort compassion. just didn't think it would take that long. but yes it rude "childish" is not the word i would use there more like blunt or crude

[kayla-la.livejournal.com]

It's so bizarre. They would have been absolutely in the right to demand one or the other, but both? Even if you hadn't posted an AB, artists tend to talk to each other about stuff like this... that was pretty short-sighted of them, to put it lightly.

[kalika-tybera.livejournal.com]

As Celestinaketzia said above, I also worked with him once before and he was great with me. I do think a year IS an awfully long time to wait and can understand him being frustrated, but you offered him a refund and he chose to wait. I'm horrified that he tried blackmailing you for both the art -and- a refund, and find the tags incredibly and unnecessarily rude.

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

I know, it's entirely my fault for that and I've felt so guilty about the wait time some people have had to deal with.

It honestly baffles me. I had the money to refund him, I would have been more than happy to, but he said he wanted the art.

Like....I just don't understand why he said he wanted the art if he was going to turn around and be disrespectful after it was finished (literally two days after the email).

[whoop-zi.livejournal.com]

yikes, that email is unsettling. regardless of the wait, that was completely out of line and pretty skeevy of him to try and intimidate you like that("my name carries weight because i've bought lots of art"-- seriously?), and i commend you for remaining professional throughout all this. falling behind happens, and it sucks, but good on you for keeping folks informed and catching up at the very least.

[teekchan.livejournal.com]

Like others, I've worked with him and he was downright amazing and very nice. This is a bit shocking. I'm not sure if I'd blocklist him, but I'd deff be wary now.

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

Oh I'm not arguing he was nice, even in the email that he sent me where he was being underhanded and asking for the refund and the art he was still being friendly and complimenting me.

Maybe he was just having a really bad week or something, and I ended up being the person in the way. :C

[spartanwerewolf.livejournal.com]

Okay, so it took nine months or so to complete, and that sucks- I been there, but the art I got was worth the wait- but shit happens, and you offered him the choice of a refund or he could wait for the art, yes?

Then I really don't see the issue he has. It seems pretty simple to me. If the artist offers a refund, then... you're entitled to either a refund OR the art. Not both. If he opted to wait for the art, then that's on him, not you.

He got his piece, so you deserve to be compensated for the work you did.

This would be like me exchanging a broken fishtank for an unbroken one and still wanting my money back. If it doesn't fly in real world transactions, why the hell would it apply to online ones?

Definitely a warranted beware. And somewhat amusing, as there is no way the mods would have put through a blatant blackmail attempt, come on son.

Good on you for not caving to his ridiculous demand.

[recca-husky.livejournal.com]

Hey there A_B
SO here we go eh?

Well i wasn't gonna take it any further since i did get the art you know.

Yea i put some key words in there that got her upset. Yea in light of the situation I should have taken the refund, but i didn't i wanted to give her a chance.

In all my years of being a commissioner i have never had this happen. I have waited years for art. Zen was a 2 year wait. Strype was close to a 3 year wait but you know what they did they communicated with the commissioner. They let me know what was going on.

If me asking for both the art and the refund is not common practice then my bad, again i have never been in this situation.

So really here if i'm childish for being upset so be it. blocked and blacklisted, No problem. my good commissioner name slandered now we have a problem.

I didn't post a journal saying "oh woe is me" now she has people attacking me. are you for real? really who is childish now? i didn't say a thing after i let it go. the tags are erased, and really maxx you need to let it go as well.


Edit: also i don't plan on doing a charge back or anything crazy like that. i got the art so it's done.

Edit 2: also i don't plan on posting a "bawww" journal either. again we talk about childish... to me this is over i'll move on and continue to support the furry community and the artist i love :)
with not only my music but my money

[celestinaketzia.livejournal.com]

The problem is in the manner you stated you wanted your refund for me. It's one thing to ask for one, but another to throw your weight around and blackmail the artist. It may not have been your intent, but that's how it came out.

imagine if it were happening to you. I'm sure if I said, "recca, I'm a mod for places like A_B so my name carries weight. If you don't do what I want you to do we have a problem. "

Edit: if anyone is harassing you outside of the comm please bring it to us via screenshots so we can deal with it. Harassment will not be tolerated.

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

I have no problem communicating with my commissioners, and responded to you each time you messaged me. I also kept people up to date with my situation through my journals as things were going on.

I have never had someone complain about my communication with them.

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

I didn't post a "bawww journal". I posted a journal carefully alluding to the situation because I was upset about it, but I didn't mention your name or even details. I didn't seek out sympathy and I find that comment to be pretty insulting.

I don't see how discretely discussion a situation of someone in anonymity is the same as you directly being rude to me in your submission.

[recca-husky.livejournal.com]

not sure if Maxx will even see this. but no worries if she doesn't
I'm sorry for that it was very rude i have no problem making a public apology!
frustration makes people do dumb things. keywords removed.
anyway take care :)

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

Thank you for the apology, I would have accepted one in private though (through email). I understand frustration and being angry, and I'm sorry it came to this.

I'm just a little hurt that you did it after telling me you weren't upset. I have never had this problem before, and I just don't like that it happened. I would have refunded you if you had only told me it's what you wanted.

[houndofloki.livejournal.com]

A year is an unreasonable wait for something paid in full upfront (you've had their money and produced no product for a long time). Being frustrated with that situation is understandable, and it would've been *nice* of the artist to offer something to offset it - but it's not a requirement. The email and tags were very tacky.

But it sounds like the guy realized that, removed it, and apologized - so no harm done, I guess?

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

Like I have said before, I know that a lot of this is my fault and I apologize profusely for that. But I did offer to refund him twice, I would have HAPPILY done so. I had the money, it wasn't a problem for me. But he wanted the art, so I went forward with the commission.

My being behind doesn't give someone the right to try and bully me into losing money and hours of work because of their standing in the community.

He apologized on A_B, and it took that to get him to remove the tags.

I do consider the situation as resolved, given that money wasn't really involved in the situation (rather someone's behavior).

[mortymaxwell.livejournal.com]

Artist, you may want to add a refunds section to your TOS in case customers come to you with questions about refunds in the future. I clicked your TOS and found no information on refunds, cancellation policies.

http://maxxmissions.weebly.com/tos.html

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

That's weird! I thought it was in there. I must have accidentally deleted it when I was adding things and never noticed. I'll go ahead and fix that. Thanks for letting me know!

[matsiwolf.livejournal.com]

TBH I don't see why this beware even exists... but since it does... it actually makes me not want to commission this artist more than it makes me not want to have Recca commission me...

Getting screwed by artists so many times that take too long to do a commission has taught me to never let a commission take longer than the limit of days you can make a paypal chargeback :)

[maxx attax (from livejournal.com)]

I don't see how me being slow is an excuse for someone's behavior. I also offered to refund him multiple times (so a Paypal chargeback would have been unnecessary at any point).

You really shouldn't chargeback someone unless it's your final recourse. Even Paypal advises you to try and work it out with a seller first.

However, if you don't want to ever commission me, that's cool! I'm not going to hold it against you. c:

[celestinaketzia.livejournal.com]

"I want the art and the money or I'm putting you on artist_beware."

How is that not blackmail?

If he wanted his money back and he came to the community? Absolutely. His beware could have been valid. That's not what he wanted though. He wanted both.