Help? Questionable Commissioner

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

Final Edit:

After a lot of back and forth with Bambiboo3, we have both come to a compromise. She offered me several, what I considered fair options, and after working with her on them we came to a conclusion. She did not refund me the total/supplies, but nor did she keep the 30% either. I believe we came to a "happy" middle. I did keep in mind slot status, and materials, so I wanted to reflect this in the final decision well.

I think we both learned a lot from all of this, and am happy to say that we can both move on from this with what we learned.

With this, I am also closing the paypal disputes and marking them as resolved also.

Thank you again for your advice/efforts.

-----

START:

I will not be naming any names right now, as I am just looking for advice. I do not want to jump the gun, so to say, but I do need advice. I recently commissioned an artist, for a rather large purchase. I did what I thought was proper research, and went ahead and okay'd everything, after finding nothing wrong.

Communication with said artist was great until I paid off most of the item. I owe a little over 100 for the item, and I have not heard anything back from them.

This is still recent however. It took place mid September, but the recent lack of contact made me wonder, so I was talking with a friend and she pointed me to the artists_beware posting(s) on this individual. I was searching their "companies" name, and not their Fur Affinity name, which in hinds sight is my fault, considering I should have been more thorough in researching.

The A_B posts really have me worried though, because it seems like repeat behavior. What I am wondering is, should I cancel the commission? Is it too early to be worried? Am I just over reacting?

I have been trying to get in contact with the artist to confirm they received payment, and also to see if they had purchased any materials, because they where to okay it with me. Ever since I sent off my initial payment, I have heard nothing in return. As we all know, a little communication goes a long way, and is easy to rest one's mind. It worries me, because this is the start of the problems from the other beware posts. I also have a deadline I need the item by, and while it is not strict per say, it is a certain time frame we discussed, and she said was doable, but again, from the beware posts she misses deadlines all the time.

I want to handle this correctly, but I also don't want to be taken advantage of, so please let me know the best route to take. Thank you!

Edit::

Firstly I will say I was contacted by the artist last night (I just saw it in the inbox) for my inquiry of fur colors. I initially emailed them Monday in regards to this (after no contact from me paying). So not a huge gap, and I finally did get an answer with what I wanted, and everything seems...back on track kinda?

However because I am still concerned, and this isn't an official beware, I will name the person.

The person is Bambiboo3. "Happy Tails" is the company name I was presented. And the commission was for a partial suit of my Corgi Character. I was given 800 dollars as the total, and still owe 150 on it.

As mentioned I am still somewhat concerned. I do believe that people can change, and I love her style, but this is a very large sum of money, and I don't want it to go beyond the point of not being able to do something about it, later on.

Edit: Edit:

I have made the choice to ask for a refund. I will post the screen shots if needed later.

Annnnd another edit:

I have had to open a dispute sadly, the screens can be found under the cut:


EDIT AGAIN:

I got the following email from her, and was repulsed. To me it sounds like she is saying that she is withholding all of my payment.

I contacted paypal twice. The first time I was told that she informed them it was something that was on commission, and non tangible, which is why they closed the case.

They closed it AGAIN due to the same reasons. I once again called, and the woman I spoke to flat out told me, she had lied to paypal.

At this point the dispute is now open again. I am terrified, and litterally sick over this. What a horrible experience.








Not sure what to do now. I've opened the dispute, as she won't refund (any) of it.

Comments

[claytronic.livejournal.com]

To be honest, naming the individual would probably get you better answers from people who have had negative experiences with them. For example, "they take forever", "they dragged me through the mud over this commission", "they took my money and ran", etc.

You should note them on FA.

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

I have made an edit, with the information.

[insane-kangaroo.livejournal.com]

I'd like you to mention who the artist is, as your post should be labelled as such.

If you made the payment in Sept, it may not be too late to get a refund from paypal if you haven't gone over the 45 day period.

I'll repeat in bold.

GO TO PAYPAL, TRY TO PERFORM A DISPUTE IMMEDIATELY!

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

I've made an edit. Yes I can still do the paypal dispute, which is still weighing on my mind. I'll think it over, with the advice of the community.

[fatkraken.livejournal.com]

I agree, please name the company/individual, if you do that you can get input from other people who have had dealings. Your post is entirely non inflammatory and they would have no reason to take offense at it.

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

I have just named them in an edit.

[ellonwye.livejournal.com]

You're obviously not obliged to mention names, but it can be useful because a lot of people here are very familiar with various problematic people.

Our advice does tend to differ on who we're dealing with. With someone quite unknown it makes sense to offer the benefit of the doubt when dealing with problems, but there are some people who do pop up here far too often and advice can quickly change from 'give them a chance' to 'get the hell out now'

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

I see what you mean, and as such I have just edited my entry to reflect an update.

[spiffystuff.livejournal.com]

It's hard to say if you don't name any names, but if they have posts here with people claiming bad communication and missed deadlines, that doesn't really look like a one-time thing that got resolved... yeah. If I were you I'd request a refund and make sure to file a dispute before 45 days is up (warn them you will do this)

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

Sadly that may be the route I take. As much as I love her suits I don't think I can rest easy knowing this. But I'll see what advice is given now, I made an edit with the name.

[magickitsune.livejournal.com]

Hm...I don't know who it is, but I'd go the honest route. Say you recently discovered that they have a history of problems with other commissions, and that you are now uneasy about the transaction. Request a refund if that's what you want, and let them know if they don't respond, that you will open a paypal dispute.

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

This pretty much is my consensus right now, however I made an edit. She did get back to me, but I also named the person and what the commission was for. I'll be listening to the advice of the community, and making a decision later.

[otherscape.livejournal.com]

I thought I recognized that name. She's had some trouble with delivering for others in the past. Her tag says it all.

[killercacti.livejournal.com]

audri is local to me and has done a fursuit commission for a local friend. her finished product is great but, according to my friend, she is VERY VERY VERY SLOW...and hard to communicate with. it took my friend close to a year to get his partial completed.

so...i guess if you're patient, it's worth the wait. but if you want something done quickly you might want to look elsewhere. she has been posting journals on FA pretty often lately saying she's streaming fursuit work, so maybe as of lately she's gotten herself on to more of a regular work schedule?

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

I did see the streaming the other day, (well the post, I missed the actual stream) but it also kinda made me wonder why she couldn't get back to me as well, on the emails, since she was online and +faving things. Other than the streaming, I had not seen other activity besides selling a head on furbuy.

I do not have a strict deadline, but I did have a month I was shooting for, and she agreed that it would be fine to do that in. I don't want to wait and wait for something, as that would just scare me more if my deadline was missed :(

[pinkpuppybelly.livejournal.com]

I've never understood why artists can't take 30 seconds to send an email saying 'Hey, here's the status of your project'. But eh. I hope you start seeing some progress soon! Her suits DO look nice.

Off topic - did you draw the art in your icon? It's adorable!

[fernchu.livejournal.com]

Pretty much this. :/ it really helps ease one's mind.

Also no I did not. Keymonster on LJ did :D I think that may be her FA name as well, but she uploads more now a days to LJ. That reminds me I need to tag that icon.

[bambiboo3.livejournal.com]

As i said to the costumer i was sad to see it come to this point.

I talked with paypal and they had said i was in the right and closed the dispute ,therefor the commissioner will not be getting a refund because they didn't want to go through with the commission which is now canceled.

I do feel this post is VERY one sided though. It took me under 3 days to respond to the commissioner http://s270.photobucket.com/albums/jj114/bambiboo3/?action=view¤t=email.jpg and taken from the email itself "It took me 3 days to reply to you because it was my weekend and i don't answer work emails during that time. Also your slot time was for january so until i start building your suit a couple day delay in response is expected as im constantly emailing and working with customers in this current month"

As for her worrying about my work,i think its very irrational to make such harsh decisions just because she found 2 entry's (that were quickly solved mind you)from almost 2 years ago.Yes i made a mistake with those circumstances and i realized it,improved,and moved on. If something this long ago is something that bothers the commissioner than i am sorry but she should have done her research as i mentioned in the message. She says she didn't know that because i gave her my new company name,BUT in my emails i clearly linked her to MY fa page with my username:bambiboo3. So there's really no excuse there.

[shukivengeance.livejournal.com]

"the commissioner will not be getting a refund because they didn't want to go through with the commission which is now canceled"

Am I misunderstanding you, or are you basically saying here that the OP is not getting their money back, nor the product that they paid for?

[taasla.livejournal.com]

Geez, just by this shady behavior, I don't think it matters if the builder's last posts were over two years old. Using the buyer's wording to weasel out of sending back payment? Oh yeah, that doesn't sound like a scam or anything.

[kawaiipiepie.livejournal.com]

I agree with this.. I think someone else further up said they feel sick about it on the buyer's behalf and I can empathize. I can't believe people can feel so entitled to other people's money when they haven't started work yet, and haven't even bought the main bulk of materials yet (fur).

I've seen other fursuit bewares and the customer usually gets all the materials with the partial refund... sounds like the seller/suit maker is planning to just keep them...?

[spiffystuff.livejournal.com]

O-o Dang OP, stick with your paypal claim and get it all back. Do consider giving the maker $$ for whatever materials she can prove she bought, but you are owed those materials.

[shukivengeance.livejournal.com]

Wow I see this post exploded while i wasn't here. This maker seems extremely shady, first claiming that you won't get the product or any refund, then that they'll refund $50 (a paltry amount), now that they're keeping 30%.

To me, not even the 30% is acceptable since that was for materials and not all materials have been purchased - above it is mentioned that they have not bought the fur.

bambiboo3, if you want to repair the damage done to your reputation by your behaviour in this post, you will fully refund this person, OR produce a receipt proving the value of materials purchased, refund all but this amount, and send the materials to the customer.
Keeping their money, even 30% of it to yourself as free supplies just to be spiteful is despicable behaviour. "It was spent already" is never an excuse and you're not entitled to get anything for free out of this transaction.

OP, if you don't get your refund, I encourage you to at least consider taking this to small claims court.

[spiffystuff.livejournal.com]

This. What's funny to me is, if the maker had refunded without fuss I bet a lot of people would have felt a lot more comfortable commissioning them, probably including the OP.

[nightmare-chan2.livejournal.com]

I watched this last night, but thought it was going to get resolved considering you had repeated yourself three times for proof of the purchased materials. I wake up and it just seems like you have run around in a big circle with the maker.

I don't know why they keep seeming to avoid you on showing you evidence but it speaks volumes that they won't - especially when at one point they came back saying how stressed they were (after you had first asked for a receipt) which leads me to believe they either lost the receipt or they haven't gotten the materials and if they do now then the date on the receipt would inform you of it. I would keep fighting for the materials and the other 30% that frankly should be from your initial payment, not from the grand total. That is rightfully yours, and I want to echo considering a small claims court.

[kayla-la.livejournal.com]

I'm betting she simply threw the receipts away. To be fair, I think most of us do the same thing, so I can't fault her TOO hard for it, however it's very much good business sense to keep your receipts for unfinished products, and hopefully she's learned to do exactly that.

At this point, her best option is to simply eat the loss, refund in full and use the materials she bought for other projects.

[ducttapeninja.livejournal.com]

I'm curious as to where the hell a fursuit commission counts as a "virtual, digital, or intangible item"-- And by the way Bambiboo, "It's a service, not a premade item, therefore Paypal can't do anything" is a really shitty way to try and weasel out of giving back the money you owe. The end product is a physical, tangible item, and I doubt I'm the only one who thinks that counts as more than just a "service."

And after seeing Bambiboo's behavior here in this post regarding the downpayment, talking down to Fernchu, and withholding the receipts for the materials, I can safely say this post is damn well warranted-- This whole thing reeks of scam to me, and I'll definitely be recommending people stay far away from Bambiboo and their "business."

[hunter-san.livejournal.com]

This. I'm very confused that a fursuit counts as virtual, digital or intangible item. I'm unlikly to ever buy/sell a fursuit - but will similar artworks also be dismissed? Like halloween costumes and wearable arts?

[kikai-saigono.livejournal.com]

She's all, "Oh those posts were two years ago and I've changed a lot since then!"

And then she goes and lies to paypal. Looks like she'll have to wait another two years.

[kikai-saigono.livejournal.com]

I would also hope that paypal has now realized that they have been lied to, and that if you can't get the down payment refunded, that you get the rest of the payment refunded and the materials sent to you so you can send them to another maker. Geez what a mess!

[meguroco.livejournal.com]

Wow, this person is unreal.

I love how you asked to see receipts like... five times, and each time she just responds with more excuses and attacks.

I hope everything works out for you, and if I were in your case, I'd fight to get ALL my money back.

[otherscape.livejournal.com]

What happened to the tags on this entry?

[kayla-la.livejournal.com]

Sometimes tags seem to just disappear, we THINK it might happen if you change the security of the post, but we're not really certain. I just know it's obnoxious since it's not like we get notified or anything and have to rely on somebody noticing and pointing it out.

[borderdog.livejournal.com]

Most makers ask for 30% of the total as a non-refundable downpayment.
They don't say "pay whatever you want and 30% of that will be your deposit." That is ridiculous.

I really want to know why everyone is saying it should be 30% of $600, when the total cost of the suit was $800?

The maker should refund any amount that was paid over $240.

The OP also does not have a right to state they don't think 30% is fair now. They should have taken that up with the maker before paying any money.

[otherscape.livejournal.com]

I agree with you on the 30% should be part of the total, so I'm not sure why everyone is saying 30% of $600. However, I don't think the artist should keep the entire $240 if they did not buy all the materials yet, which is what I think the OP is referring to when she says 30% is unfair.

[bambiboo3.livejournal.com]

As i dont want to copy and paste this to almost every comment im going to put this here.

WE DONT AND NEVER HAVE WANTED TO KEEP ALL $650

We have offered to refund EVERYTHING except the 30% non refundable downpayment that is used for materials,to reserve your spot in our que and anything else needed.

The commissioner is wanting us to list out everything that was bought and to be used on there suit and for only that money spent to be kept. To answer that someone above pretty much summed it up "It's not really possible for her to show you a bunch of receipts for 2 bags of glue sticks, 1 marker, 1 pair of scissors, 2 spools of thread, a brand new airbrush or trimmers, etc.. that were to be used exclusively for your commission" For us to list out,glue sticks,thread,felt,polyfill,foam,balaclava,plastcs for eyes, paints,buckram,fleece,vinyl,sculpty,velcrow, trimmers,airbrush,elastic,shoes,mats for feet,paintbrushes,markers,razor blades,ect, that would be used for the suit would add up to more than $240.But we were trying to work with her on a better deal that the 30% is all that would be kept.

[shukivengeance.livejournal.com]

It's still not right for you to keep $240 for free. You are not magically entitled to someone else's money. Just because you spent it doesn't make it yours.

[lackoflollies.livejournal.com]

... Wow.

[otherscape.livejournal.com]

Ditto.

[borderdog.livejournal.com]

Do you guys not understand what non-refundable deposit means?

If the customer changes their mind and cancels, they do not get their deposit back. Why do you think fursuit makers ask for non-refundable deposits, just for fun?

[rebel-mel.livejournal.com]

The problem is that she didn't even make the commissioner aware that it was non-refundable until after she first claimed she wanted to keep all $650, and then she suddenly claimed that the 30% deposit she initially only said was needed to start work was also non-refundable. In addition, the non-refundable deposit is to cover materials purchased--and she can't prove she's even done that much with the money.

[bambiboo3.livejournal.com]

Your refund has now been sent via paypal.

(frozen)

[kikai-saigono.livejournal.com]

are you going to send her the supplies you bought or did you refund her the full amount?

[ljmydayaway.livejournal.com]

OP, if she hasn't sent a full refund/30% + materials she purchased/whatever your deal was, don't close the claim until this ordeal is finished. If you do, you won't have another chance to get back your $.

[sunhawk.livejournal.com]

This whole entry is now a pretty clear example of an artist cutting off their nose to spite their face, holy moly! @_@