&quot;Artists Beware&quot;

1. Name of Service: PayPal
2. URL: http://www.paypal.com
3. Countries Supported: International
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: Credit Card, Paypal Balance, E-Check
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: Direct Deposit, Check, Debit Card
7. Ease of Setup: Very easy, though sensitive information is needed for best ease of access.
8. Pros: Quick, easy to use, widely accepted.
9. Cons: Foggy TOS has caused a lot of problems. PayPal can freeze your account with any amount of funds at their discretion. Payments for Adult merchandise are not accepted.

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It was found that paypal is OK with drawn adult merchandise (in this case for us, art) so long as it isn't bestiality or underaged characters. (basically if it's illegal, it's a no no) I am pretty sure anthro is safe by paypal at the moment unless they decide to get off the fence.

If this isn't right anymore though, do correct me. but I did get this from someone who had written a journal saying "I emailed paypal and they told me this"

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The problem with that is that each PayPal representative gets to decide with their OWN OPINION what is and what isn't okay in each case.

Some cases have been deemed as okay by some representatives, but like with Lillium, they closed down her account and her husbands over someone writing "gay bondage" in the title of one payment. I believe her husbands was re-opened, but even when she explained the person was buying a portfolio, which SHOULD be okay by their TOS, she was not allowed her money.

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ah! That's very unfortunate. :C
the worst I've done is had "commission from FA" in my notes but it's never set off an alarm to paypal.

we'll all just have to be careful

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That's why many people have turned to sending invoices to their customers instead. It lets the seller bill the customer, though doesn't allow for tipping, unfortunately.

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that's true, but it's still beats loosing your account ;P

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razzek.livejournal.com

It's also worth noting that PayPal is only okay with adult material of the artist variety if it's physical media. So if you do digital artwork, archives, or anything of that sort, you're out of luck.

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wait..why is that? That's so silly!

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10. Associated Fees: 2.9% transaction fee on the total sale amount plus a $0.30 fee per transaction.

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razzek.livejournal.com

1. Name of Service: AlertPay
2. URL: http://www.alertpay.com
3. Countries Supported: international
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: credit cards, p2p direct payments with other AlertPay users
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: bank transfer, bank wire, check
7. Ease of Setup: moderate, does require sensitive information and security checks, can take a few days to set up
8. Pros: fast acquisition of customer payments, many options for customers to pay, decent customer service, accepts more international countries than most services
9. Cons: currently unable to deliver money to US users, currently unable to accept US credit cards, charges small fees for money transfers

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latilombax.livejournal.com

I was about to use AlertPay almost immediately after verifying my account, but I was disappointed to see that Visa and MasterCard weren't working

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1. Name of Service: Propay
2. URL: http://www.propay.com
3. Countries Supported: all
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: credit/debit cards. Internal transfer between Propay users (new feature, I have not seen it used yet)
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: Direct deposit to bank account or use of debit card. Direct deposit generally takes about 3 days to fully process. you can trigger it whenever you want, but there is a small fee.
7. Ease of Setup: Very easy. does take a few days to set up bank info correctly.
8. Pros: easily integrates into many ecommerse website templates. You can send invoices via email. You can process cards manually over any internet connected computer or can use a swipe system. You can also process cards over the phone, so great for cons. Phone processing can be done with a plug in reader for smart phones OR by keying it into any touchtone phone (I use a $10 tracphone) easy refunding system if you need it. High transaction limit.
Good online management and you can download transaction logs for easy accounting.
Can be used on Ebay.
9. Cons: It does have an annual fee. (google "coupon Propay" and you'll often find coupons that will reduce the fee) It does have a transaction limit which may be an issue for a few fursuit makers. For standard account its $500 per transaction, $3000 for the month. There is a plan with a higher limit, but you need to call them to set them up and they may ask for some additional documentation.
Adult materials are forbidden by their TOS.
10. Fees: varies by account type. for lowest account type 2.99% plus .30 Visa/mastercard/discover. 3.39% plus .30. subtract 1% from V/M/D rate if you use a swipe rather than keying it in. Transfer money to checking account, $.35.
Lowest account type, $79.95 annual fee. (on sale at $59.95 for december) You can frequently find coupons online for a discount.

OVERALL: I do use this service and I like it very much. I would recommend it if you find yourself in need to being able to process credit cards at a physical location (or do lots of cons) or run your own ecommerce site. It's much more cost effective than most normal credit card servicers and doesn't require additional equipment beyond a computer and/or phone. I did a cost comparison with this several other servicers (like Novus) and you need to consistently do over $1000 per month in credit/debit transactions before traditional credit card services became more cost effective.

I would NOT recommend it for people with low monthly volume or that only do business over the internet through 3rd party ecommerce sites. It's not cost effective compared to other services then. If you're consistent;y doing less than $100 monthly and do not attend cons, this is overkill.

Edited Date: 2011-12-08 03:07 am (UTC)

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1. Name of Service: Bitcoin
2. URL:http://bitcoin.org/
3. Countries Supported: ALL
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: Bitcoins (see below)
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: variable (see below)
7. Ease of Setup: Very easy
8. Pros: Complete anonymity, international transfers, no restrictions on type of items sold. It's basically virtual cash
9. Cons: No buyer/seller protection. Variable value. Converting from Bitcoin to local currency is a bit weird.

Bitcoin is basically a virtual currency. It's like virtual cash so has no restrictions. HOWEVER, since this is a CURRENCY, you must convert your local currency to Bitcoin or Bitcoin to your local currency. exchange rates can be very volatile! You are not guaranteed the exchange rate will stay stable.
Wikileaks actually is the big user of Bitcoin because of the anonymity. There's been some talk by leaders in African Union as using Bitcoin as a universal African currency since it can be transferred easily between cellphones (like a virtual euro). Africa traditional banking system that it would actually be much better than minted currency. Has not actually happened yet, just in discussion. So there are some large legit users. HOWEVER, because of the anonymity, it is very much Buyer Beware. there is no way to dispute a transaction gone bad! There is also risk down the road it may be pounced on by UN or various law enforcement agencies because its easy to sell illegal goods or launder money.

would I recommend it? it's high risk with potentially high reward for those who primarily spend money online. It has all the volatility of the stock market so can go VERY VERY wrong. Early adopters could win big... or lose big. Probably best for tech heads that would be using commission money to obtain their own commissions or things available only in virtual form. Don't use it to pay your rent.

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You can also set up your home computer(s) to help Bitcoin compile data, which then makes you bitcoins.

My husband did that for a while to trade them in for Linden currency on Second Life.

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petercat.livejournal.com

I ran the client to do that for several weeks, but never earned any Bitcoins. The client estimated that on average, it'd have to run for over a year before I'd earn any. Then I heard a podcast where someone figured it would cost more in electricity than the Bitcoins would be worth (this was after the value crashed).

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It depends on what processors/video cards you have, and what other software you use. My husband has a very high end videocard and was getting a bitcoin every 3-7 days or so 6 months ago. It can burn out your system though, so that's why he stopped.

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fatkraken.livejournal.com

Bitcoin is a joke. Don't use it.

Even if you "win big", it will be by exploiting the losses of others, because the "currency" will never have actual value. There are also more risks than simply transactions gone bad, there is a very real risk that the exchanges will lose data or someone high up will simply steal everything because there is absolutely no accountability.

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yeah, I'm leery of it thus my comparison to the stock market. for there to be winners there must be losers. that it could all go tits up at any moment is a definite concern.

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bridgeportcat.livejournal.com

Yeah, what fatkraken said. Aside from the volatility of the market (which is mostly down-down-down) a lot of the people involved (from my observations and such) have their fingers in a lot of weird and skeevy pies. I know that one of them is involved with a mlm scheme and I think (I could be wrong) one of them got arrested. Bitcoin is a weird pipedream alternative currency that kind of gives me the willies.

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draike.livejournal.com

1. Name of Service: Google Checkout
2. URL: http://checkout.google.com
3. Countries Supported: U.S. and U.K. only for merchants, international for buyers.
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: Credit or debit cards only.
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: Direct deposit to a bank account.
7. Ease of Setup: Easy. SSN required for US residents if you don't want to have a monthly payout limit on your account. I signed up today and didn't have to pass any extra security checks. I was ready to go in the 5-10 minutes it took to sign up.
8. Pros: TOS is well-written and easy to understand. Fees are no worse than what PayPal charges. Their store gadget is nice bonus too if you'd like to make your own storefront, and integrates with AdWords if you use that.
9. Cons: Payments for Adult merchandise are not accepted. Limited to sellers in the U.S. and U.K, and limited to buyers who have credit or debit cards.

May not be ideal for taking commission work based on the shopping cart setup, but excellent for selling physical items if you have an inventory. Lots of options for different levels of business.

Edited Date: 2011-12-07 09:05 pm (UTC)

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oxlilliumxo.livejournal.com

I took a few payments for art through Google Checkout recently. A couple days later, they flagged my account because I didn't put enough information on what I was selling in the email invoice.

Now they're asking me to provide a business website, a copy of my business license (which I have come to understand that I don't need in my state in order to do business, since we don't have sales tax), a copy of my driver's license, etc.

When I signed up, they had the option to select "I don't have a website," but it turns out they require you to have one if you don't want your account shut down. = 3=

I'm personally finding that it's a bit cumbersome to use. Once you get payment from someone, you have to charge the payment in order for it to actually pay you. Unlike Paypal, where you simply get the payment. And you have to go through a few clicks to even find out what your account balance is.

Now that they have Google Wallet, if I want to get to my Google Merchant account, I have to Google "Google Checkout" in order to get the right link. I can't seem to find the "Merchant" link from Google Wallet.

Basically, if you're not an actual business running from an actual website, then you might not want to bother with them. I hope this helps people decide whether to do business with them or not.

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oxlilliumxo.livejournal.com

Oh, I forgot to mention. I can't seem to find any sort of customer service representatives to talk to, either.

The Help Forum doesn't seem to have any Google reps working in it (or at least, I haven't found any responses from any reps), and I can't find any way to email them with my issue or call them.

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1. Name of Service: NoChex
2. URL: http://www.nochex.com/
3. Countries Supported: varies by account type: personal P2P UK only, Seller UK credit & debit cards and P2P, Merchant international credit & debit and P2P
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: P2P or credit/debit, depending on account type
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: transfer to bank
7. Ease of Setup: looks easy, don't personally have.
8. Pros: Basically is Paypal, UK edition. easy drop in to ecommerce sites and shopping carts
9. Cons:very low account limits for personal accounts and fairly low monthly limits for seller.
10. Fees: 2.9% plus 20 pence for personal and seller, variable for merchant (call for pricing) plus a 50 pound setup fee.

Edited Date: 2011-12-08 03:10 am (UTC)

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1. Name of Service: Moneybookers (in process of changing name to Skrill)
2. URL: http://www.moneybookers.com/
3. Countries Supported: all
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: credit card, bank draft (echeck), digital wallet
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: bank draft
7. Ease of Setup: easy
8. Pros: can be used on ebay. International payments.
9. Cons: confusing pricing structure and is about twice the cost of Paypal. Also some transaction types cost the SENDER a fee, which may put them off. Forbids "porn and hardcore content or services" (pinups may skate through as "not hardcore")
10. Fees: CONFUSING. http://www.moneybookers.com/ads/merchant-account/us/fees/

Edited Date: 2011-12-08 03:13 am (UTC)

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1. Name of Service: Dwolla
2. URL: http://www.dwolla.com
3. Countries Supported: US only
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: draws from bank account
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: deposit to bank account
7. Ease of Setup: looks easy. For business accounts you do need to provide a valid tax ID or EIN.
8. Pros: very, very low fees No charge for transactions under $10. flat $.25 for transactions over $10. Does NOT prohibit porn! TOS does not appear to prohibit any type of item. somehow allows payment via Facebook and Twitter. I'm a tad baffled by details.
9. Cons: Only usable with other Dwolla accounts. TOS is buried on the signup and basically seems to say "we can suspend your account for any reason we think you're being shady" but isn't real specific why.

I have no effing clue how they're making money. Maybe on overnight float of a fractional loan where they're earning interest? this looks a bit TOO good. Slightly leary of how vague the TOS is.

should you use it? if you've got a tipjar or are doing lots of little commissions, you really can't beat the rates!

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kaputotter.livejournal.com

Here's some info... you can find this on the first page of Google search: http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-11-11/tech/30381380_1_credit-card-interchange-fees-paypal

But not this one:
http://www.boston.com/business/technology/articles/2010/12/01/dwolla_a_new_player_in_electronic_money_transfers/

Will be interesting to see how it develops.

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I know you can make quite a bit on fractional overnight loans between banks if the money is large enough. I'm guessing that's where they're making the majority of long term money and the $.25 is pretty well day to day cash flow. (weirdly our town comptroller used to do this with the town money. He'd yank everything out of town account, make an overnight loan of a million + at a tiny, tiny percentage, it would be yanked back out at 5am for start of town business. it adds to quite a bit over the course of a year)

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aggro-badger.livejournal.com

I'm under the impression, from the reading I did as I was setting up a dwolla account, that dwolla itself is just the software/service, and the actual money is being handled by a credit union (Veridian of Iowa). So the fees, small as they are, are not really dwolla per say. I thiiiink this is good, as dwolla itself doesn't have an incentive to hold your money and roll around in the interest.

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latilombax.livejournal.com

I was thinking about signing up on Dwolla in case I have some issues with PayPal. Good suggestion

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fatkraken.livejournal.com

I know this might not be applicable, mods may delete if inappropriate, but a good 2/3 of my cash comes in this way and I find it very convenient. It is an online method of moving money around, so I think it is relevant.

1. Name of Service: Direct bank transfer
2. URL: N/A
3. Countries Supported: UK (I am talking only about UK banks because they are what I know)
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: direct bank transfer, can be performed online or by phone if your account has that access, or in-branch if not
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: Direct Transfer
7. Ease of Setup: middling to hard. Most accounts allow internet banking which will include the ability to make online transfers, but if this is not set up on your account it's a bit of a job since it may require you to go to the branch and receive paper mail to verify your address/identity. However since most people go to the bank fairly regularly anyway, adding this small chore to the list is not a big deal. Also, having internet banking is EXTREMELY useful for other reasons so there's no reason not to have it.
8. Pros: often instant (depending on bank). No charges even for large payments. No prohibitions or monitoring of goods/services. No middle man. It is the electronic equivalent of taking out paper money, giving it to someone and them paying it into their account. Direct payments into a business account make calculating tax at the end of the year very easy using bank statements
9. Cons: set up can be a faff. International payment may require other hoops and/or incur charges, I've never tried it. I don't know what kind of fraud protection is available, it will likely depend on the bank.

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taasla.livejournal.com

This can also be done in the US. The only downside is that my bank, Wells Fargo, makes you give your bank account number to the person sending.

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fatkraken.livejournal.com

Yes, this is a necessary part of the process in the UK too. I didn't add it as a con because there's nothing they can actually DO with that number on it's own. The UK government has bank transfer as an option for paying national insurance, and they give out the number and sort code of that account to MILLIONS of people for them to make payments. If it's a safe enough practice for the government to engage in, I figure it's safe for me, but I can see how it might make some people uncomfortable

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razzek.livejournal.com

Does anyone know if this is true in the US? I've always been told one should never give out one's account number because it can be used to drain your account or something else nefarious, but I'm not sure if that's true. This is pretty much the only reason I've hesitated just doing direct money transfers.

Also, does anyone know if it's possible to arrange international direct transfers?

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shukivengeance.livejournal.com

Yes it is, but you will need some more information, depending on the bank.

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petercat.livejournal.com

And the bank fees (in the USA at least) for international wire transfer are outrageous.

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merlin-the-wise.livejournal.com

They're absolutely insane for Canada and Australia too, as far as I know all international wire transfers are charged ridiculous fees. And depending on your bank, they can be a real pain in the arse to set up.

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vellacraptor.livejournal.com

Just a note, add "Fees" to the section too maybe? I know it varies from site to site and some are just ridiculous. At least it'd be nice to be able to see them at a glace for quick comparison.

But awesome post! * U*

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Ah yeah, that would be helpful! I'll add it in, and if anyone would like to amend their post, they can feel free.

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1. Name of Service:Serve (was Revolutionary Money Exchange, RME)
2. URL:http://www.serve.com/
3. Countries Supported: US only
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: SERVE (they fund it off a credit/debit card or bank account)
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: American Express Debit/ATM card.
7. Ease of Setup: fairly easy
8. Pros: Interestingly allows multiple accounts on same login, so you can have one for your work, one for your spouse, one for your kid, or just separate different business transactions. so you could have one account marked "deposits" one marked "works in progress" and "completed" so you aren't tempted to spend money before you finish stuff. P2P transfer are free. transfer between subaccounts are free.
Payment by e-mail, just like PayPal
Does appear to allow SOME adult material
9. Cons: since its an american express card, may not be accepted by all merchants. NO FANART. (see below)
10. Associated Fees: 2.9% plus .30 if you fund your account from a credit card OR receive a payment for goods/services. $2 ATM fee (you get first one per month free, all subsequent are $2) there may also be an ATM fee from the ATM owner. (apparently if you live in NY, arkansas, or Vermont resident, you are charged none of this. it's buried in the TOS)

Buried in TOS under prohibited items: " Infringe on our or any third party's copyright, patent, trademark, trade secret, or other intellectual property rights;"
don't use it for drawing copyrighted or trademarked characters.
as to the adult material it specifically prohibits: "unlawful sexually oriented materials or services". if its legal to sell, okay. not legal, don't do it.

also prohibited: "Use the Service or a Serve Sales Widget to sell or distribute human or animal parts of organs, blood or other body fluids, or prohibited seeds or plants or other organisms in danger of extinction or otherwise prohibited by Applicable Law;"

It's unclear to me from the phrasing if that's ALL animal parts or just endangered animals. If you sell fur or skulls, you may want to call for a clarification.

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trimblecat.livejournal.com

1. Name of Service: Wepay
2. URL: https://www.wepay.com/
3. Countries Supported: It allows US citizens to accept payment from all countries (Fees may be charged on cards issuers discretion) but internationals can't accept payment using it. (In other words it's one way)
5. Payments Accepted from Customers: Bank and Credit
6. Method of Payment to Account Holder: It's held on wepay account until you draw it into your bank account. (1-2 business days)
7. Ease of Setup: Haven't actually tried it
8. Pros: Has a free online store set up, allows you to sell on your own website, can order a wepay debit card
9. Cons: People from outside the U.S can't accept money via a wepay account. It's sort of a one-way deal. No porn
10. Associated Fees: 3.5% or a 50 cent minimum (Credit card) or 50 cents flat for bank accounts for every item sold

I haven't actually signed up for it. I actually heard about these guys because they did a stunt by dropping a block of ice with hundreds of dollars frozen in it in front of Paypals office that said "Paypal freezes your money". I figured it'd be worth mentioning. I'm also not very savvy when it comes to technical stuff in the TOS so maybe someone should review it to make sure I didn't miss anything.

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trimblecat.livejournal.com

for bank account payments* Sorry it's late at night.

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