Commissioner Beware: Touya_Vulpes

[ritz-bitz25.livejournal.com]

WHO: I am an artist that goes by Ritz_Bitz on FA. I was commissioned by Touya_Vulpes on FA.

WHERE: During my livestream art session.

WHAT: I was livestreaming $10 shaded headshots done traditionally. People could have them laminated and mailed for $1 more. He was the first to order and got his art that night. 2 days later, on December 5th, I recieved an email that the funds were on hold and I needed to take action in the resolution center. I responded saying "He got his art that night, its intangible goods but he has the file already so I cannot offer a refund". Today, the 19th, I got an email saying the payment was reversed and given back to him. Turns out I'm not covered as a seller of goods unless the item is shipped, so he was able to make a claim he never recieved it and I lost my case because I couldn't ship this intangible good.

WHEN: Livestream took place on December 3rd and he recieved his art the same night.

PROOF:





EXPLAIN: When the hold was placed, I was confused but figured something wasnt verified with his account or such. I didn't contact him at this point, I answered the case in the resolution center and waited. Today I got an email that the payment was reversed, and I saw that the $10 had been sent back to him from my account. Upset and irritated, I noted him about it and he said "Oh I've been having issues with paypal for the past couple weeks. I don't know what it is." I told him he needed to resend the money or I was gonna delete the art and go through paypal for a resolution. He acted slightly irritated, saying "*sigh* fine just delete the art". I already completed the work, so obviously I wanted to be paid for it. I called paypal and spoke with their customer service.
It turns out he filed the claim that he never got what he paid for, and I had no defense with it being 'intangible goods' that I did not ship. This is why I lost the case.


I DID get my money back, however I am extremely displeased with the way the commissioner acted, trying to get his money AND have the art. He has been blacklisted now and I have changed my commission policy to having all the work I do shipped out so I can protect myself.

Comments

(frozen)

[snapcat.livejournal.com]

Its all about the Seller Protection PayPal itself offers. If the seller loses money due to a returned bank payment or even a chargeback, if the seller has tracking information showing delivery to the provided and confirmed Buyer's shipping address, then PayPal will cover the seller for the loss out of their own pocket. In the case of emailed or intangible goods, they choose not to cover these items.

(frozen)

[ritsukaao.livejournal.com]

I have never heard of Paypal covering a chargeback/returned bank payment out of their own pocket EVER. Even when I've provided shipping confirmation to Paypal for something I shipped, the buyer still insisted they never got it so issued they a chargeback. I was out 40 dollars until I raised hell and high water but Paypal just ripped it back out of the buyer's account, they didn't pay out of their pockets.

I've also been told by a representative of Paypal that they cover goods like digital art as long as the seller corresponded in email and can provide those emails to Paypal if need be. I bet if I called back though, I'd get a completely different rep that will say something different. That's the problem with Paypal, they don't even know their rules/TOS.

(frozen)

[snapcat.livejournal.com]

When you have a chargeback filed against you, as long as you have tracking information showing that your buyer received the package to the shipping address paypal provided you, you will win your case. You do have to go through the appeals process which can take up to 75 days. Its the way payment processing is whether you go through PayPal, Square or your local bank's services.
What you were told about emails is wrong. Emails can be faked so PayPal does not accept them as proof.
Its up to the CSR whether to make a person wait for the appeals process or issue a credit to the seller's account out of their own pocket. If its a customer service issue and the rep wants to help ya out, they will just toss up to $100 in your account. Its a matter of how NICE and PROFESSIONAL people are when calling in.
I worked for PayPal in fraud and with issues such as this for 3 years. I know what I am talking about.

(frozen)

[ritsukaao.livejournal.com]

Then it's a flawed system don't you think? One CSR can completely throw someone under the bus because of how THEY interpret the rules but another CSR can fork over 100 bucks to please a frustrated customer. I must be talking to the wrong CSR because no matter how polite/patient/professional I am, I always get told too bad unless I harp on it. In fact, the story I mentioned they finally caved and pretty begged me to stop calling and they would refund me right away with the seller's Paypal.

I actually have a worse horror story of Paypal involving someone wracking up purchases on my account without my permission (like identity theft with my Paypal) and Paypal told me it's not their problem. That's another long story though that I'll save for another day.

(frozen)

[snapcat.livejournal.com]

Sure. People aren't robots and can't adhere to a strict rule book no matter how well they are trained. There are idiot co-workers and awesome problem solvers at any job.

(frozen)

[ljmydayaway.livejournal.com]

It's called firing people who can't abide by the rules, OR at least involving more than one customer service rep. It's not hard to do. Really.

(frozen)

[snapcat.livejournal.com]

Think of any idiots you worked with that did the bare minimum to get by. How long did it take them to get fired... if at all?

(frozen)

[oceandezignz.livejournal.com]

Please stop namecalling. It is against comunity policy, even in cases of hypothetical people. It is not okay.

This is your warning.