Advice on refunds

[springmoone.livejournal.com]

Here's the situation:

I sold a partial fursuit (head, hands, tail) via an auction site to a buyer. They paid in installments and that was all fine, and I sent them the suit. It arrived safely, but upon inspection they decided they didn't like it because it was hot, the mouth was not as mobile as they would have liked, and the vision was not what they expected. I offered to take the suit back to work on it (make vision adjustments, fix the jaw, and add a fan) for free. They would still like a full refund, minus shipping charges.

However, I'm short the money for the refund. The payments came in in small installments and that all went right out the door to pay for printmaking class supplies (one of the reasons that I made and sold the suit in the first place). If the suit was returned I would be able to work on it and re-sell it, but there's no guarantee that I'd be able to get the same amount that it originally sold for.

Should I ask one more time to take it back for repairs/refurb or is a refund justified in this situation? Should I suck it up and borrow from a friend to pay the buyer back? I don't know how to handle this. Even if I did re-sell the suit I might still end up in the red. I can't responsibly take on more work/projects to make up for the shortfall, and I'm not having luck in my "day job" search right now.

Edit: It was a premade

Edit II: The buyer has been working on their own head and has realized they can be quite hot (especially in the summer sun). I am going to put a fan in the head (good experience for me anyway) and all will be well.

Comments

[greenreaper.livejournal.com]

If you go down the refund route, since you were paid in installments, perhaps you could propose paying the refund in installments? This would allow you funds to make any changes you need to sell the suit and ultimately ensure that everyone gets what they want. They just have to be willing to loan it to you for a while. Which is really only fair, since you made a suit particularly for them and now they don't want it and aren't giving you the chance to make reasonable amendments for free.

[brownspotz.livejournal.com]

You went above and beyond by offering to modify the head. I wouldn't offer a refund.

[alohawolf.livejournal.com]

This.

[kusuriurii.livejournal.com]

I agree with this, especially since it is an finished product.

[intj-reflection.livejournal.com]

Was this an auction for a custom partial or a premade? I had assumed premade until I read Greenreaper's comment but now I'm uncertain.

[springmoone.livejournal.com]

Premade

[intj-reflection.livejournal.com]

OKay, with a premade partial you would be going over and above to even make adjustments to the suit. Your commissioner was taking chances on purchasing a product in As Is condition. I honestly don't feel like you have any requirement to offer a refund, but if you're feeling pressured to do so you are within your rights to ask for the sort of payment plan that you offered to them.

[Edited to clarify derp phrasing.]

[kayla-la.livejournal.com]

For a premade, I wouldn't offer a refund UNLESS there's a real technical problem that makes the suit practically unusable or the like, and it's actually your fault. But so far, it sounds like buyer's remorse.

That said, if you decide you want to refund them in the end, doing it in installments as they did should be perfectly acceptable. But based just on the information in your post, I wouldn't say you owe them a refund just because they changed their mind.

In the future, you may want to consider adding something like this in your TOS, that you'll only give refunds on pre-made products in case of damage or the like (something that's actually your fault), and not because 'I've suddenly decided I don't actually like it even though I knew what I was getting'. Then you can point people to it if this comes up again.

[zaulankris.livejournal.com]

If the product is outright defective, a refund would be in order but... do you think it is? I am being serious. Fursuits are hot, moving jaws don't work on everyone (especially premades) and vision is nearly always not that great. If you accurately represented the item at auction and the 'faults' are within the expected range of a fursuit, offering to make adjustments is more than fair. I don't know the situation, but refusing free adjustments and asking for a full refund sounds like buyer's remorse, which isn't your problem.


edit for word salad

[springmoone.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's defective, personally. It is at par with my current generation masks (made in 2013), which have good build quality. I obsessively examined some big name maker heads at AC; my expressions aren't on par with them yet, but in terms of technical execution mine are equally sturdy and well-finished inside. I went to a rave in my personal head (built on the same base) and while hot it wasn't unwearable.

The price was very low. A partial with paws, tail and head for $300.

[zaulankris.livejournal.com]

That's what I thought. Oops, rereading what I wrote I think I may have come off a little harsh. Not intentional <3

$300 for a partial is low, in that range it's expected you're going to have some minor derps here and there. As long as it's not unwearable or a safety hazard, it sounds like a fair deal. If that's the case, if your guy has buyer's remorse they should resell it themselves; that's what everyone else does.

[springmoone.livejournal.com]

word salad is almost as good as tuna salad!

[vauvakolibri.livejournal.com]

Were how much of the things the buyer had issues with mentioned before they paid? Like mention of jaw movability/lack of fan/field of vision etc? (I don't know if these are generally mentioned how in selling these things)
Mainly because though I do think a buyer should have the option to get a refund, if they had info before hand and still bought the head... When buying these I think there needs to be some consideration by the buyer too.

Personally I think your offer to fix said issues would have been enough if those were the problem, but if it comes to the refund, I agree with greenreaper that you paying in small parts would be the most fair way to go. And if the buyer doesn't agree to that, then (especially after refusing the fixes) it smells like they're not wanting a refund just because the problems they have with the head...

[sbneko.livejournal.com]

I'm sort of on the fence about the first part. On one hand, it does feel like issues should be mentioned, but at the same time, isn't it like buying a full mask at a store? It's hard to see, it gets hot, but this isn't mentioned on the package since it should be common knowledge or something you look into before buying.

I'm unsure how I feel about it, but it seems like it'd make more sense to mention issues that aren't the norm. But from everyone I know who's owned a suit, there isn't really a way to not have these issues, it's part of the costume.

[vauvakolibri.livejournal.com]

Yeah I'm admittedly not sure about the issue myself, though in store bought masks there's generally (or I'd think, I've never bought masks from shops except ones tied from behind and never seen other types sold so bit limited here on expertise) a test or try out piece you can test? At least it's what I'd want first if I bought one since I've never worn a full head mask, which also makes me think that like others mentioned this might also be a new guy who's never worn a fursuit head before and gets buyer's remorse because of that.
(This is why I never buy clothes or similar from the web :D)

[sbneko.livejournal.com]

Ya, but those masks are like, 5$. If someone wanted to spend 300$+ then I'd sort of be their responsibility to see a way to try it first, like a friends. Not everyone can of course, but then you're taking a risk. I'm honestly not sure what I think about this haha

[vauvakolibri.livejournal.com]

I know, that's why I said in my original comment that there needs to be some consideration by the buyer (also on the part of them understanding a pre-made item won't be tailor made).
"It'd sort of be their responsibility to see a way to try it first, like a friends."
To be fair, I think suit heads can be made in different ways depending on the artist, so testing a friend's possibly tailor made and more pricey (like maybe one with a fan etc) might give them a possibly wrong idea that all suit heads are made in way X and so on...
Overall that still won't really excuse a buyer's remorse if this person is having it.

[clockmagic.livejournal.com]

I'm curious if the person who bought it has ever worn a fursuit because yea they do get hot, it's a premade the risk fo the jaw not fitting to move is chanced at times, and if you're new to it vision isn't as awesome in suits as people think for the most part.

Technically I think there isn't anything wrong with the suit so I don't see a refund being an option.

[kaelstra.livejournal.com]

It was premade, and, presumably sold "as is", in which case, the buyer isn't entitled to a refund. You offered to correct the things (for free!) that they didn't like, and got told no. If you had further contact with this person, I'd say that you're not going to issue a refund for a non-custom piece. Offer again to fix up the things they're complaining about, and if they say no again, tell them sorry, but you aren't issuing a refund for the suit.

[thefancyhorse.livejournal.com]

Since it was a pre-made, I'm of the opinion that if the buyer doesn't like it, then they need to try to sell it to recoup the money, and not bother you with it.

BUT, you could be nice and offer to advertise them selling it. C:They may or may not make the same amount on it should they choose to sell it.

[mazz.livejournal.com]

Buyers remorse, you do not owe them a refund, offering to fix the suit for them was more than what anyone else would give selling a pre-made suit.

[sbneko.livejournal.com]

It seems it's possible that maybe they've never had a head before so they didn't know that these issues are common place on all of them. I've never worn one, so I know I'd find it odd at first. I personally hate heat, so a head would be much hotter for me then others, which might also be his issue.

[springmoone.livejournal.com]

yes, it's their first head.

[catwithpen.livejournal.com]

It was a premade; you do not owe them a refund. If the buyer doesn't want it anymore, they should resell it themselves, it's not your responsibility. It was very generous of you to offer to alter it for free.

[skulldog.livejournal.com]

Going to second and third comments so far. If someone bought an premade item, and decided it wasn't want they wanted, tough shit. As long as you were clear and upfront about sizing, and any small issues, it's up to the buyer to read, understand and deal with any common problems you as a creator were upfront about.

Premade items carry a little higher risk, and the lower price to buy one covers the fact that, buying a premade is not being done to your exact fickle personage, and that's why it's not a commission.

[timelapsedecay.livejournal.com]

I can't believe they would try to get a refund out of this to be honest, it's a premade. They need to resell it themselves if they don't like it

[poizenkat.livejournal.com]

since it was a premade, I'd say not to refund them. Besides, I have those issues with my current suits and I'm pretty sure it's normal. When you're wearing something covered in fur, it's supposed to be pretty hot and when you have something covering your eyes, it's supposed to be a bit harder to see.
the moving jaw thing is disappointing though and I'd be upset about that as well, but not only did you offer a fix but a premade suit that isn't going to fit extremely well is bound to have issues like that. for example, I cant use the moving jaw in my wife's suit because it's not fitted to me.

[lackoflollies.livejournal.com]

I hope you have proof it was shipped and all that.

In case you say no to his refund request, and he does a paypal dispute for the money sent regardless.

[smokeandspots.livejournal.com]

You've done the work. The most this person should get in refund is half, if even that. It sounds like they want a refund for insignificant reasons and nothing on your part. I would add a refunds policy to your TOS for future occasions, but in this case, either offer no refund or (at most) a half refund minus shipping and cost of supplies, and blacklist this person (i.e. don't work with them ever again). They paid for the suit they wanted and then made up quibbling reasons to get their money back when they decided they didn't want it, but that's not how business works. You've done the work they asked for and even offered to make some revisions; it honestly sounds like they're just being picky now.

[springmoone.livejournal.com]

The person was really nice and courteous, so I don't think that I would add them to a blacklist or anything. I don't think they're bad, just they didn't really understand what they were getting into with fursuits (especially in summer).

I added this clause to my TOS: Pre-made costumes are sold in as-is condition. Pre-made costumes are not designed for an individual fit like custom commissions are and should be purchased with this reality in mind. If you are dissatisfied with your pre-made costume, I am not obligated to provide a refund once the transaction is complete. I may, at my discretion, take the costume back for necessary alterations under my normal warranty procedure. I am inclined to do this if the item arrives damaged.

[smokeandspots.livejournal.com]

I didn't see a lot of the other comments until after I made mine, so this sounds perfectly reasonable. :)

That looks like a great clause to add to your TOS to cover this and future incidents like it. :)

[spiffystuff.livejournal.com]

If there are no "surprise" issues with the head for the buyer (like, something was not as advertised, or smell/smoke issues, a deadline for an event was missed due to late shipping, etc), and there was no agreement about returns/refunds, you don't owe the buyer one.
In general I feel it would be good business to do so, if possible, provided you get the piece back as you sent it first and they haven't used it other than to try it on (wearing it to a party then returning it is a no-no). Because it is scary buying a costume online when you can't try it on first, and I think a lot of buyers would be reassured if sending it back were an option. But you do not owe it to them.

I do agree that if paying you took time then a similar time period for refunding is okay in this scenario even if not ideal, though they need to send you the head back ASAP.